The Ongoing Aftermath of the Clippers Cap Circumvention

Shap, Justin (@laclippersfilm), and Cole (@colehoops) take a moment to sit down with the Clippers cap circumvention scandal and think about the repercussions to the fanbase, the franchise, and Kawhi Leonard's legacy as a Los Angeles Clipper.

Speaker 1: Hi, this is Ralph Lawler.

Speaker 2: Welcome to The Lob, The Jam Podcast.

Speaker 1: What's up, everyone? It's The Lob, The Jam, The Podcast.

I'm Japan. Coming to you guys with Justin at LA

Clippers Film. How are you, Justin?

Speaker 3: I'm doing well. I'm doing a lot better than Steve

and Gillian these days.

Speaker 4: So, um.

Speaker 5: Plus one for me. I haven't cheated, so I'm doing great.

Speaker 1: How are you? Haven't cheated. Haven't cheated yet. Let's see

if Bobber might say. Cole is also here. You guys

might be familiar with these two. They've been recurring guests

on the pod. Everyone's kind of done their own thing

for a minute. We haven't had Justin and Cole on

for a bit. It's been just like timing stuff. Plus

also the Clippers. I mean, it's the heat of the summer.

The Clippers have been in this mess lately. I'm happy

to bring them back to you guys. Cole is also here.

How are you, Cole?

Speaker 4: I'm doing great.

Speaker 2: I don't even know the last time I was on.

Sometime during the season, for sure.

Speaker 1: It's good to.

Speaker 4: Be on with you guys, as always. Just chop it up.

I'm doing good.

Speaker 1: I'm doing well. The Clippers, however... Or maybe doing the

worst they've been in a long, long time. And that's

saying something for this franchise. I'm not going to go

over all the logistics entirely. Five first round picks from

2029 to 2033. Lucas and Rob did a really good

job also chatting it up about it. But we kind

of wanted to get a bit of a round table

on our regulars that are on the pod. And I

wanted to talk about it too. Because, man, this has

just been... You know, I've actively avoided... talking about this

subject because it's just, I don't know, not basketball related.

And for a very long time, I'm not going to lie,

I thought the Clippers were just going to get a

slap on the wrist. I thought that they wouldn't be

that stupid to not be able to cover their tracks.

And then I got a whole 36-page document that said

they are that stupid. So, and has proven me wrong.

You know, I have plenty to say about this. Justin,

you know, how... How have you felt kind of coming

to this final call that, you know, came on all

of our computers from Shams and then that huge document

that really detailed a lot of the Clippers, you know,

if you're going to do something wrong, do it right.

And if they did something wrong and they just did

it wrong, I don't really know how much more to

say about it. The whole time in my head, I thought,

you know, I don't think the NBA is a morality game.

You know, Steve Ballmer is a billionaire. I'm not going

to pretend like he's a great person that's never stepped

on some, you know, crack some eggs. So when all

this came out in my head and many of our heads,

I was like, you know what? Some shady shit probably

happened here, but there's no way this incredibly rich man

just kind of laid it all to the fire, had

somebody like Gillian do all this dirty work and not

covered his tracks in a way that, you know, Pablo

Torre could start an expose on. And then finding out

all these multiple companies involved in this, when it just

felt like it was just aspiration and then everything blowing

over and being laid out, you know, pretty, pretty, you know, succinctly.

It felt like I was reading a play when I

was reading through that. you know, a kind of funny play, honestly,

but one that made the Clippers look quite bad. It's

really hard for me to come out of this other

than saying, man, the Clippers really tripped on themselves and

didn't do it with any sort of foresight. How did

you feel about this, Justin, leading up to the verdict

of this and now that we've kind of read what

feels like a pretty damning piece of evidence against the Clippers?

Speaker 3: Well, first, I'd say that, yeah, it looks dumb now,

but if Aspiration doesn't go bankrupt, I don't know how

much of this we even know.

Speaker 5: So from that perspective, how dumb was it? I don't know.

I don't know.

Speaker 3: It looks pretty dumb, especially some of the emails that

came out in that report. But I think a lot

of it has to do with just Aspiration. But nevertheless

um leading up to it i felt kind of like

you do that it's pretty clear that something smelled there

and like some form of cap circumvention happened um if

for nothing else the i think i shared this with

y'all in the in the group chat in the group

text that the um just the sheer size of his

endorsement deals with these companies are just so much larger

than anything you could imagine. Leonardo DiCaprio and Drake were

two of the endorsers for Aspiration, and they're not getting

paid nearly as much as Kawhi Leonard. Just industry standard.

There's barely any any sort of endorsement basketball or otherwise

that would pay you $ 20 million for, to do nothing

and like have like 20 plus million dollars in stock.

So like that to me, just, yeah, this is, this is,

this is exactly what it looks like. But I'm, I

kind of was on the lines of like, yeah, there's

no way they're going to have enough information to, um,

there's to like actually nail them with anything. Like, I

think the proverbial smoking gun is what everyone was like

referring to it as. And, um, yeah, lo and behold,

they had several smoking guns and they had several like

made up emails to like cover their tracks. And we've got, uh,

we've got Lawrence keeping notes, right. So just in case

this all goes bad. And so, um, it turned out

that it was way worse than we could have expected. And, um, yeah, I,

I just like leading up to it, I was like his,

this endorsement, the size of these endorsement deals financially are

just ridiculous. Like, and so I was, I was sure

that something went bad here. Something was wrong here, but

I really didn't think the Clippers would come down with

an hammer. And, um, what the news that came out today,

it kind of just made me like really, really, really disappointed. Um,

just because, um, You know, Steve is someone that is,

for better or for worse, near and dear to a

lot of Clipper fans' hearts. Like, he's done a lot

for this Clipper fan base, and a lot of it

is in pursuit of trying to win. You know, I

use this analogy to where, like, you know, he has

this really expensive coloring book, but sometimes he just doesn't

like to color in between the lines. And so we

just got to try and get him to color in

between the lines more. Today, I think Pablo said that

like the NBA approached him with like a settlement that

he just flat out refused to engage with. And then

that led to the hammer. And that part of it

is where I am today, where I'm just like really

disappointed in this entire ordeal. And yeah, he could have

saved us a few draft picks if he just admitted fault.

And at that point, you're putting pride over the Clippers.

And that's kind of like the first time where I'm like, damn,

you know, um, we're really fucked. So, um, yeah, that's

kind of like, um, where I'm at present day. Um,

but what, what'd you say?

Speaker 1: Man, the Steve Ballmer stuff, you know, it has felt

like Steve Ballmer has just been kind of proud this

whole time. Um, and that makes it feel even, even

more so. Um, if, if we ultimately, and it sounds

like we're slowly finding out, That a lot of this

could have been avoided, like picks and penalty-wise, for Ballmer

to just be like, okay. And we'd get nothing of

it because of that. Yeah, he goes from that billionaire

who was willing to buy this arena and move the

Clippers out of Staples and you know, not all billionaires

are great, but at least we got this billionaire. At

least we got this guy who wants to win all

that stuff to just being a really short-sighted kind of egomaniac.

You just like needs to show he's right. You know, it's,

it's saddening.

Speaker 4: Right.

Speaker 1: Because, you know, I have, I've even, I've talked, I

met bomber and just thanked him. I think, I think

all of us, you know, coming off of the last

clipper scandal, uh, when Donald Sterling was pushed out of

the team, were just so grateful. I think every Clipper

fan wanted a moment to just thank him. Thank you

for taking us away from this guy who had no

interest in winning and just wanted to make profit. Now

it's like we have the opposite problem where we have

this guy who just wants to win so badly that

he almost can't get it out of his own way.

I'm not going to pretend like I'm damning Balmer forever.

He's still going to be this money faucet that never

ends am I disappointed yeah is he still going to

be the billionaire that pours into the Clippers forever I

probably you know so I'm not going to pretend like

I think he's as bad as Sterling or this or

that because you can't get nearly as bad as Sterling

as far as I'm concerned when it comes to ownership.

He is on a level onto his own. But I

think my disappointment with Bomber has only grown. And that's

a shame because I thought this guy wanted to do

nothing but win. And he has been putting his foot

in his mouth. What feels like this whole time, this

scandal has been going on for a bit of pride

over some faulty business. Let's take a quick break. I

want to hear Cole's takes after this. All right, we're back. Cole,

before I keep rambling, man, I want to hear all

your thoughts on this entire scandal and where we are now.

Speaker 2: So I'm actually learning... a lot of these details in

real time as you guys kind of just break down

all the details because I haven't been quite as hip

to it, but that's pretty alarming and pretty, I don't know,

like you said, Chap, coming from the Donald Sterling era,

there's no way that anyone could top that. And what

Steve brought to the Clippers is, and continues to bring

to the Clippers, um, just has to make fans happy outside.

I mean, outside of this part, obviously, but like the

will to win the will to want to make the

Clippers a better product, a more respected product. So like

all of that is one thing. Um, but I do

wonder if, you know, talking about the settlement part and

he didn't want to do that. And so the NBA

kind of felt like they needed to drop the hammer.

Like if some of that ego, uh, also made them decide, like, no,

you guys can't pursue anything else after this in terms

of arbitration or anything.

Speaker 4: Like, it's done.

Speaker 2: Like, they're just kind of sick of it at that point.

But just going back to the whole beginning of this thing, I, too,

thought that they would be penalized. But kind of the

same things that everybody else has said. Like, I'm sure

other owners and other teams do similar things, NBA teams.

probably doesn't want to be too harsh on the Clippers

because it can open up a can of worms. And,

you know, what about this team? What about this guy?

But the more Pablo Torre kept going and continues to go,

like it kind of just became a matter of time

for me. And then, you know, just from my perspective as,

you know, a Clippers supporter, it's kind of just like, Shapp,

in your line of business, I'm sure people are like,

you know, just Put me under and do the operation.

Speaker 4: Just get it over with. I don't want to know

the details. You know what I mean? Just do what

you got to do. So there have been plenty.

Speaker 2: Of details and things that I've either avoided or just

chosen not to get into when I've had the time

to do it.

Speaker 4: I just want to wrap it up. You know what

I mean?

Speaker 2: But now that it's gotten to its conclusion, I don't know.

Speaker 4: Maybe there's even more. Pablo keeps.

Speaker 2: he's got a, he's got a deep bag, so I don't,

I don't know what else is to come, but just disappointing,

disappointing on, on, you know, the, the players side on

the organization side. Um, obviously the, the penalties are crazy, um,

but honestly deserved. So, um, it's just very unfortunate. Things

like this tend to happen, uh, to the Clippers. So that's,

that's kind of where I'm at with it. Um, I'm

sure everyone is ready to just move on. It's going

to be hard to do that given the penalties and whatnot,

but it is what it is.

Speaker 1: Yeah. I do want to talk about moving on and

how the Clippers are kind of expected to move on

from this. Shout out to the people who managed to

just talk about this all the time, particularly like our

guy Adam Oslin, who did a really great job kind

of following this on Clippers Talk. And I know there

were other Clipper people that followed it a little bit closer.

I just wanted it to finish. Like, I didn't want

to talk about it. And now I have no choice

but to talk about it. And I can't help but

talk about it now for probably the foreseeable future because

the Clippers, destination-wise... have really been knocked down a peg

after we thought that, oh boy, this team is recouping well.

off of Kawhi Leonard. They're getting all these picks from Toronto.

Maybe this is going to be a disgruntled asset place.

You know, what was it, Justin? We're talking about being

like Flip City or something along the lines of this season,

flipping assets, rehab and flip. Just kind of get what

you can. I was all about that. The Clippers have

nothing but players who you can kind of rehab and

hope to flip for picks. And I kept thinking, oh boy,

you know, if the Clippers don't get dinged from this thing,

they could be a destination quite quickly here. And that

feels like it is out the window because the Clippers

are down all these picks for five years. Bomber is

not admitting to any wrongdoing. And the longer he doesn't

do that, the more likely I feel like five picks

will be the call because I want to say the Timberwolves,

after arbitration, after they kind of stepped aside, got a

first-round pick back in two days. And Bomber's nowhere near that.

And if he drags his feet like he's doing, it's

just going to kind of strangle this team from any

superstar wanting to be here. And we're going to get

people like You know, Benedict Matherin or the next version

of him. These assets where nobody else will give them money.

It's not going to literally be Ben Matherin. Of course,

he's gone. But guys that teams are waffling their money

over and then we have to take them in to

help them kind of prove themselves. These prove it kind

of guys and the people who want to win. Why, Justin,

why would you come to the Clippers now? if you

want to win in the next couple of years, is

there an argument for that? How does this affect the

Clippers' status over these years?

Speaker 4: Plenty.

Speaker 3: The one thing that Cole and you alluded to that

I think also to just circle back to put a

button on it is the fact that the Wachtell and

Friends report ended with they reserved the right to revisit

and adjust punishment as more information comes out. And if

you listen to Pablo's latest episode as well, it's very

clear that this potentially isn't over. And I think that

is one of my biggest worries and concerns as Balmer

continues to at least publicly say he's going to fight

this It's that we're going to get into unforeseen territory

as far.

Speaker 5: As potential punishment is concerned.

Speaker 3: We already are there, but that report had a company

that we'd never even heard of. How many more are

there that are like this? At some point, we've just

got to cut our losses before we dig ourselves an

even deeper hole. But just to answer your question, I

don't think the Clippers are that far off as far

as being a destination. Ty Lue has a good approval

rating with coaches. Doesn't look like he's going anywhere. I'm

not sure NBA players, maybe this year, maybe like this

upcoming next summer, it'll be a thing because the Clippers

just lost picks or whatever. But You still have Los Angeles.

You still have an owner with a deep pocket. You know,

you'll have tons of cap space. And so that will

always be a level of appeal to me. Now, you

do lose the opportunity to trade for guys that are

under contract. So in the event that like an Ant

Edwards or somebody just says, fuck it, I'm out, I'm

ready to leave. that's what the Clippers were kind of

angling for and preparing for.

Speaker 5: Before this verdict.

Speaker 3: But I still think that in the event that you

can navigate and get to a free agency, the Clippers

will be still, I think, relatively speaking, appealing. There's a

lot to like, and the check's still cash, right? The

check's still cash, and you're in Los Angeles. That's always

going to be um, appealing. And I just don't know

how much this really, um, impacts their, um, reputation as

far as players wanting to, um, play in Los Angeles.

You know what I mean? Um, so, but I mean,

that just, that remains to be seen, but, um, yeah, they,

I think the Kawhi trade is a good starting point, right?

And there's Derrick Jones Jr.

Speaker 5: On his team.

Speaker 3: There's Chris Dunn on his team. B.I., Garland, there's stuff

here that can add on to the two unprotected firsts

and swap that they are getting in that Kawhi deal.

Speaker 5: So all is not lost.

Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's... a fair place. Let's take another

quick break and come right back after this. All right,

we're back. You know, Cole, you know, as far as

being a destination, let's say before this hammer came down

on a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being hyper destination,

1 being I want nowhere near that place. How would

you rank the Clippers before the quote-unquote hammer and after

it as far as a star who's maybe disgruntled, who's

maybe like an Anthony Edwards type, who say, let's say

in two years, LaMelo Ball busts and they get knocked

out of the first round two years in a row. Now,

I've been, you know, I... I looked at the Lomelo

ball trade personally, and I thought, oh, that's a timer

on that. There's two years on this thing. If they

can't kind of figure this out with his sidekick, then

Anthony Edwards is probably going to want out. I want

the Clippers to be one of those places. Where do

you scale the Clippers now as a franchise that's desirable?

Because I agree with Justin. I do think that they're

is a lot to be enjoyed about this Clipper team,

even let's say after a bomb or suspension is over,

as far as being state-of-the-art arena, having an owner that's

willing to spend money, who wants to win. But just

in terms of pure assets and not having first-round picks

to maybe flip if a guy like You know, like

LeBron James wanted when he went back to Cleveland and

wanted a flip for a pick, maybe a high-end pick,

even if it was a pick that was already attained,

to get a win-now star. Because, you know, we don't

need to go further than Kawhi Leonard to see what

a superstar incoming wants and thinks of a young core,

you know? So where do you kind of put the

Clippers now as far as before and after for one

of those kind of disgruntled asset-type stars?

Speaker 2: So I think before, like if you'd asked me this

two months ago, I just said probably around like a seven,

seven and a half out of 10, uh, for all

the reasons that Justin already touched on, um, an owner

that'll pay the arena, uh, the location, all of that, um,

being in LA, like that part is lucrative. Um, obviously

now you throw in the basketball part with All the penalties,

probably not going to be as competitive or able to

build as great of a contending team, at least not

in the short term. So that makes it obviously less

desirable for somebody who's wanting to get out of a

situation to go win. But then I think two, three,

four years, the farther removed from the scandal you get

where it's not.

Speaker 4: As bad.

Speaker 2: Big of a stain or of a headline as it

is right now. I don't see why the Clippers couldn't

get back to the place that they were at even

a couple months ago, because it seems like they were

trending towards the place that they were back in 2018, 2019,

before the 2-1-3 era where, you know, they got all

these draft picks, they had competitive veterans, they had some

nice young pieces. And they were kind of planting seeds

for the next era. You know, that's kind of what

they were doing this offseason. I don't see why they

couldn't be in that situation once the dust settles a

few years from now. It's still going to be L.A.,

assuming that the team isn't taken out of L.A. with

more penalties and whatnot. But I think that right now

is going to be a little bit of a setback.

for obvious reasons in terms of appeal for one of

those star type players. But I don't see why they

couldn't be back in that market two, three years from now.

Speaker 1: Yeah, Cole, let me ask you a question before I

ask Justin one here. Did this have much of an

effect on you as a fan? I think there's been

lots of talk about how Clipper fans have been affected. Like,

seeing this happen after the gut punch that was, you know,

Donald Sterling and all that. Um, and like the enthusiasm

towards being a Clipper fan and like wanting to follow

the team and all that. I think we're all three

of us are, are lifers for better or for worse. But, um, I,

I'm curious, I'm curious Cole, like how this kind of

hit your fandom. Cause I do remember when the Sterling

thing happened, um, I remember game three in Golden State.

And I remember game four. And I've never been kind

of number, like more just out of it watching a

playoff game than I was for game four. Like I barely,

it like was hard for me to read. One, the

Clippers got blown out pretty easily in that game. But

it was really hard for me to even absorb that

a playoff game was happening. Keep in mind, this was like,

This is like early Lob City era. The Clippers had

only had like a couple of years of even being

in the playoffs at this time. And this was, you know,

that was probably their best Lob City team as far

as I'm concerned. That was their best team. I was

really excited about that team. But I remember when game

four happened, how just very numb I was to the game.

And I was like, oh, this, I really thought for

a moment, I actually came back to it later on.

I thought, oh, this postseason is done. I was like,

there's no way they're going to be able to recover

from it. Kudos to those Clippers. They did a great

job recovering until the debacle that was the Thunder game

in Game 5. But they made me believe for a second.

But I remember it was a huge gut punch. And

then the summer coming after that, I was like watching

the loss, all the court hearings that was happening. And

it was weird before the whole new owner thing kind

of lifted me out of that. You know, Cole, how

did hearing about this new news kind of affect your

fandom and your feeling as a fan towards this team?

You know, because I'll be honest, like all this stuff

happening with Bomber and this thing, For the longest time,

even to a degree now, I thought, oh, the Clippers

are going to win a championship. I thought that once

the ownership was in place, I was like, oh, I

think it's going to happen. When it's going to happen,

I don't know. But I'm pretty comfortable in saying that

I think the Clippers are moving towards a championship place,

even if it didn't happen in the 2-3 era. And,

you know, this is a little bit.

Of a concern about where bomber is and how much

he is not willing to maybe put his ego aside

for the sake of being right. But I wonder, like,

has this affected your fandom at all? And do you

think it should affect Clippers fans at all and how

they root for the team now?

Speaker 4: Yeah, I, I think it should.

Speaker 2: Me personally, it, it hasn't that, that much. I think,

Really just the fact that it's been so drawn out.

Like it took a whole year. We knew what was

going on, or at least we kind of knew what

was going on for a year now. It was dragged out.

And it was also coinciding with year after year of,

you know, maybe regression is not the right word, but

just being farther removed from the high that was the

summer of 2019. and the championship expectations and the type

of star power and expectations that had built up over

the first couple of years. And then some of the

roster moves that brought it back down, some of the injuries.

It just seemed like every year it was kind of

just a ticking time bomb. And it was almost like

a nightmarish scenario, a nightmare that you couldn't wake up from.

So this is more so like just the perfect ending

to that era, in my opinion. So like with Lob City,

it didn't feel like that at all. And obviously what

Donald Sterling did was way worse than some cap manipulation

type stuff. So that felt like more of a gut

punch because it was so sudden and then it was

just over. This has felt like the end was near

for so long. And then now this is just the

cherry on top. So I think in a way, mentally,

It didn't hit the same. The punishment hit pretty hard

like that. That wasn't expected. And that that sucks for

the future of this team. So I think if anything,

that's where it can kind of hurt the fandom a bit.

Speaker 4: But yeah, it's just the last three years or so.

Speaker 2: And then Shep, I know you always allude to once

Kawhi got hurt against Utah, that was kind of the

beginning of the end right there. But the last few years,

it's just kind of felt like it was, you know,

it was just a matter of time before this thing

needed to end. And this is the way it's ending.

So from a fan's perspective, it hasn't, it hasn't taken

that type of toll on me that maybe it has

for some people.

Speaker 1: Yeah, that's fair. You know, Justin, Justin, I kind of

want to ask you the same question, you know, even

more so, you know, how, I think we kind of

talked about this a little bit in group chat too.

And then, of desperation, the Clippers were for, for quiet

and uncle Dennis and just like do anything possible to

make this guy happy, like, and to do whatever it is,

like whatever shady stuff, whatever money it is. I will

admit like reading it. I was just like, man, like,

It's almost like when you see like, I don't know,

when you see like one of your friends being abused

in a relationship and you can see it sort of happening,

but they just keep going back because they just need

that validation or whatever. And you're like, dude, this is

so bad for you. Like, what are you doing here?

Reading that out was just like, why are you guys

doing all this? And I don't know, maybe it's just

like first time with a superstar or they're just doing

all they can. And, but I will admit like reading

that was like, what is, what was this franchise doing

going this far? And for all I know, maybe this

has happened. Some things like this have happened similarly before

with other superstars that, you know, just got a taste

of our first franchise. Like, you know, like would the

Lakers have done something wild for magic Johnson or something

crazy like that? Like maybe, you know, like, Uh, and

maybe this stuff is being aired out and gives that idea,

but I will say like, it felt really gross, like

reading all that stuff. It was just like, wow, what

are you guys doing here? And are you going to learn?

You know, I, I do, I agree with Cole. Like my,

I do think that there's an effect here. I do

think this is a bit of a cherry on top.

I'm still a clipper fight. I'm not changing any of

that stuff. And this shady stuff is not as bad

as rooting for just a really disgusting human being, not

just a financial cutthroat of a human being. And Donald Sterling,

and obviously none of us really root for owners, but

you kind of have to keep a little bit of

that inventory once you get older. Right. But I will say, like,

the degree of desperation, like, are there things that you

feel like the Clippers, you kind of expect from the

Clippers to do to kind of rid of that desperation?

Like even through how the front office is held here, like,

do you expect anyone back aside from Balmer? Like when the,

when the dust kind of clears here?

Speaker 5: Me personally?

Speaker 4: Yeah.

Speaker 3: Nah, I, I, I can't imagine like this time next

summer we're like, yeah, there's Lawrence, right?

Speaker 5: There's Steve.

Speaker 3: Like it's just business as usual. No, I can't. I,

that would be, that would be quite stunning. You know,

it feels like, it feels like, um, that was part

of why they gave Lawrence.

Speaker 5: The extension, right?

Speaker 3: I have no way of knowing that, but it's almost like,

you know, if, if you, if something happens where you're

taken care of and.

Speaker 5: I don't know.

Speaker 3: How could someone like Gillian work in this industry again?

Speaker 5: Totally.

Speaker 3: You know what I mean?

Speaker 5: That just doesn't.

Speaker 3: Make any sense to me. I'm much like you guys.

Speaker 5: I get it.

Speaker 3: I get why certain Clipper fans have had for lack

of a better term, an existential crisis right now. I

totally get it. But like You know, for me, not

at all. Not at all. You know, when you sign

up to be a fan of a sports team, you

kind of, like, sign up to, like, silently acknowledge that

within reason, there's going to be some level of callous

lack of morality. You know what I mean? Like, it

just comes with the territory. And, like, obviously, when certain

things rise.

Speaker 5: to.

Speaker 3: Certain levels that kind of makes you question your fandom

when it like really like starts to like fuck with

your spirit or something like that. Kind of like what

Sterling did or like what, what, what the, what Sarver

and Phoenix had going on. But like, you know, Steve

paying Kawhi more money outside of his contract doesn't like

rise to.

Speaker 5: That level for me. It certainly sucks.

Speaker 4: Right.

Speaker 3: Like as a Clipper fan, like, this this resulted in

setting our franchise back like five to ten years or

whatever so that definitely sucks but like that that's not

gonna make me like turn in like my fandom card

you know um i guess part of me being the

internal eternal optimist is like okay let's this is a

real challenge right now and you're really gonna have to

use like the g league you really are gonna have

to use like your second round picks and you really

are going to have to make even more shrewd trades

and flipping guys at the right time and things like that.

So on, on some level, I find it, I find this,

this era of the Clippers, um, a little intriguing, but, um, nevertheless, I,

I don't, I, this is not something that I personally

felt like was going to make me turn in my

fandom card or anything like that.

Speaker 1: Um, but, Do you think it'll affect attracting Clipper fans?

Like the team has actively been doing, like spreading out

into the community and everything?

Speaker 4: No.

Speaker 3: The thing that affects attracting Clipper fans is losing. And so, like,

at the end of the day, games have to be played, right?

And if the Clippers can put together a 40-42 win

team here and just be competent, get into the play-in,

see what happens.

Speaker 4: Yeah.

Speaker 3: You can, you can, your fortunes can change quite quickly

in this, in this league, man. Like the people left

Phoenix for dead just last year. And like their long-term

outlook is still like pretty shitty, but like they're competent.

And like, I think that's a bar that the Clippers

can still reach even with all those picks out the

door right now. And I think that's what they're trying

to aim for. I think that, that, I think that's

what they were aiming for even before this verdict came through.

So from that regard, not much has changed. They are

going to try and find good players on affordable deals

that don't impact their future flexibility. And they're going to

try and flip them at the right time, kind of

like what they.

Speaker 5: Did with Zoo. And we'll just move on business as

usual that way.

Speaker 3: But to circle back to what you were saying, earlier,

that part was the most disappointing for me. Just investing

that much into Kawhi Leonard. This is honestly not even

a take on Kawhi Leonard. I genuinely don't think there's

any NBA player that's worth buy first round picks, the

on-court talent, and the risk of salary cap circumvention. Because

in that report, and y'all can correct me if I'm wrong,

but I believe that as early as the pandemic, Dennis

was asking our leadership about off-the-court earnings. And I think

he said the Clippers were hooking him up with bullshit

deals at that time. And that, and, and if you

guys were in that business that early, it makes me

think that, oh yeah, you guys promised this in the

recruitment of Kawhi. And at that point, that's where I'm

disappointed because like, you know, it's time to go.

Speaker 5: Like you can't, you can't, you, you got.

Speaker 3: To, you got to exit, exit, exit stage left if a,

if a player is asking for that much.

Speaker 5: And that's probably the, And that's probably.

Speaker 3: The original sin of this whole era, you know, because

I said it on social.

Speaker 5: I said it to you guys.

Speaker 3: By the summer of 2019, the franchise had never been

in a more healthier place. They had the ownership. They

had the smart front office. They had all their picks.

They just drafted Shea. Even Jerome Robinson ended up being

a bust. But at that time, he still had potential

value that they could flip if they needed to. They

were just in such a great, healthy spot. And to

throw it all away and risk circumventing the cap for

basically a singular player, it just reeks. It just reeks

and it sucks. But yeah, I'm still a Clipper fan.

It's going to take a bit more than paying players

more money than they're allowed.

Speaker 5: To make me turn in my fandom card.

Speaker 1: And doubling down on a dumb thing.

Speaker 4: Yeah.

Speaker 1: I do want to talk about Kawhi Leonard after this break.

All right, we're back. Justin, what do you think about

Kawhi Leonard the Clipper? How will you remember Kawhi Leonard

the Clipper?

Speaker 5: Wow.

Speaker 3: Wow.

Speaker 1: Who is Kawhi Leonard the Clipper?

Speaker 3: So I think, I think, You probably can't help but

the first thing you think about is all the games

that he missed, right? Unfortunately, that's kind of like the

first thing that comes to your mind. But also, too,

i when he was at his when he was right

even last year he was one of like the best

players you've ever seen like he's probably he's the best

basketball player when he was on the floor the best

basketball player to ever don a clipper jersey and um

Just an insane, insane.

Speaker 5: Talent, you know?

Speaker 3: A local kid, you kind of wish it worked out

a bit more, man. Like, the story was perfect, but

it didn't work out. I'll probably remember. I remember the injuries,

and I remember the potential. Like, you just remember, like,

Game 6 versus Dallas, Games 3 and 4 versus Utah

in 2021. you know, the first game against Phoenix in

23 in a playoffs, um, just could never string together.

Speaker 5: A whole entire playoff run.

Speaker 3: But, um, you know, I remember the highs and the

lows and you just kind of wish he was on

the floor more.

Speaker 4: And, um, Yeah.

Speaker 3: Unfortunately the injuries and how many picks this costs, this

is going to be his legacy, which sucks because I

genuinely feel like this was an amazing basketball player who

like just, Oh, he was second team all NBA just

last year and deservingly. So he had like, I think

I saw it the other day. He had a damn

near 30 game stretch just last season where he averaged

almost 30 a game on like over 50% shooting. Like,

He's an incredible basketball player. And, like, you know, if

you asked me, like, three years ago if he'd still

be this good, I don't know.

Speaker 5: I would be stunned.

Speaker 3: So, like, it's actually quite stunning that he arrived at

the end of his Clipper tenure this good. So, like,

that part of it still sucks to me. But, yeah,

the injuries and the picks are probably what you're going

to remember most about him. But that sucks because he's

an incredible talent.

Speaker 4: Yeah.

Speaker 1: Do you think it's justified that Clipper fans, like, Their

reception of him the next time he's in Intuit Dome

will be colored very much by this penalty.

Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, yeah, without a doubt. Because, like, you know,

you can't police and tell people how to be a fan, right?

Fan is short for fanatic. Like, you know, we all

have fans. We're all fans of players. we're all fans

of teams. None of this really makes sense in the

grand scheme of things anyway.

Speaker 5: So like, yeah, fuck it. Like, you know what I mean?

Speaker 6: He should get booed. Like he cost us 10, he

cost us 10 picks.

Speaker 1: Like, and he put us in a salary.

Speaker 6: He completely killed our reputation and none, like it's, it

definitely is a, it's a ridiculous, it's a ridiculous moment

in Clippers history and, And it's really unfortunate.

Speaker 3: That all of our best players have just the worst

negative association with us as they're walking out the door.

And that's something that the franchise is going to have to, like,

stop doing. Like, whether it's Blake or, like, CP or now, like, Kawhi. Like,

every great player that plays for us, it just ends

terribly well.

Speaker 5: So we got to fix that.

Speaker 1: At least Bill Walton came back and did color commentary.

Speaker 5: Oh, yeah. That's kind of my earliest. Yeah, man. Yeah, man.

But yeah, shit.

Speaker 3: I don't think he should get a video board. I

think the boo should be loud because... he did it's

it is what it is that's what that's what that's

what happened right he calls us 10 first round picks

and we have one western conference final to show for

it and like you know he he could have he

could have put it into this uncle dennis business right

like and he didn't totally so and here we are

so like you know it comes with the territory but

he's he's a grown man he'll be all.

Speaker 1: Right he'll be fine for sure.

Speaker 3: Yeah He only lost $ 700, 000 out of like 50, 60 million.

Speaker 1: Man, screw him. He'll be fine. He is fine. I

really don't think he's suffering too much right now. But yeah,

you know what? I do low-key support the booing because

you have to look at the results. You leave, you

come back, you're back on a contender out east and

Klipper fans will boo. And Kawhi Leonard got off of

this as close to, you know, scot-free as possible and

I do think as an adult you do have some

responsibility as far as where is your money going you

know he is fortunate that this ended up as less

on him as possible but that was a gamble and

I agree with you Justin like I do think ultimately

I'm going to remember Kawhi Leonard as having those moments

but as far as the legacy he's leaving this you know,

the 10 first round picks and the fact that he

shackled the Clippers for many years afterwards because of just

kind of financial, I don't want to say financial negligence.

You ask the guy, do you want more money? Help

me out with more money. I'm your family member. Give

me more money. I mean, there, there are a litany

of basketball players who have suffered from that. And there

are also a litany of basketball players who have paid

the consequences because of family members who didn't know when

to stop. Um, So I think Kawhi will get booed.

I think it'll be merited. And I think he'll be

just fine. Cole, I was with you, Cole, when we

saw one of Kawhi Leonard's worst playoff games in that

game against the Dallas Mavericks, the Ty Lue game. We

were sitting next to each other. That was not the

Ty Lue, the Terrence Mann missed layup game at the buzzer. Uh,

so we've seen, we, we, you know, that was a

moment in that fourth quarter. I was like, wow, it's

not going to get much worse than this for Kawhi Leonard. Um,

I was wrong.

Speaker 4: Boy, were you wrong?

Speaker 2: Um, yeah, that was also, I'm pretty sure that was like.

Ray John Rondo's last hurrah.

Speaker 1: Oh man.

Speaker 4: That post season.

Speaker 1: Ray John Rondo. Should the Dallas Mavericks be angry at

this era of Clippers doing all their weird stuff because

they had been, they essentially said no thanks to Jalen

Brunson because of that playoff series. Anyways.

Speaker 4: Started Boban.

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 4: A bunch of stuff was going on there. Yeah.

Speaker 2: I mean, I'm, I'm one of the bigger Kawhi fans

out there. So I probably have some bias in me. I've,

followed him for quite a long time since he was

at King, and obviously San Diego State and whatnot. But yeah,

I'm going to remember his time with the Clippers. I'm

going to think of the era. It was a disappointing one.

There's no other way around it, and for as great

as he was when he was healthy, Um, obviously the,

the team got a little bit worse. The, the players

around him got worse as the years went on. So

his greatness wasn't as meaningful in a way or as impactful, um,

or maybe even as appreciated because what he did this

past year was, was maybe the best year he had

as a Clipper, maybe the best year of his career, um, as,

as an offensive player, at least. Uh, but the team

was never seriously going to compete for anything and didn't

even make the playoffs. So kind of pointless, but I'm,

I'm just going to think of, you know, what is it?

Two playoff series wins or three, two, I think. And that's,

that's kind of his, it is what it is. He

came to the organization in my mind thinking, you know,

he was, he was going to take this second franchise

that had never been to the mountaintop before and try

to do something I would imagine that's what his thought

process was.

Speaker 4: Maybe it wasn't.

Speaker 2: Maybe there were other motivating factors behind it, as we

see with the money and all that type of stuff, too.

Speaker 4: But he took a.

Speaker 2: Franchise that was in a tremendous spot, as both of

you guys pointed out earlier, and left it in a

lot worse spot, which is not like something.

Other superstar players don't do. Um, but there tends to

be a lot more success along the journey that makes

the ending.

Speaker 4: Kind of worth it.

Speaker 2: Um, it's something that you could look back on and

remember the good times, but there really isn't going to

be any of that. Like we're, we're not going to

look back, um, you know, 10, 15 years from now,

five years from now, whatever it is, and think of

all the great moments, even like a lob city provided

to us. Cause I just don't think Um, there were those, uh,

there were some cool regular season moments. There were some

individual performances sprinkled into, to some of the playoff series as,

as we talked about already. But I mean, when I,

when I, when I think of Kawhi Leonard in a

Clippers uniform, I'm just thinking of a lot of regular

season stuff.

Speaker 4: And that's not what, uh.

Speaker 2: The goal was summer of 2019 when him and Paul

George came along and, tried to take this franchise somewhere

that Lob City couldn't. So unfortunately, that's just the reality.

No matter how much of a fan and supporter I

am and continue to be for Kawhi, that's just, it

is what it is. Those are the facts. So, yeah,

just kind of unfortunate. And he will get a hefty

amount of boos whenever he returns. And I won't knock

anybody for that. Cause yeah, it's, it's a tough spot,

tough spot to be in, especially with him not really

getting any punishment, uh, to kind of just go to

Toronto and, you know, get to do his thing over

there while the Clippers are set back quite a bit. Um,

but yeah, that's, it is what it is.

Speaker 3: Yeah.

Speaker 1: He'll wish he'll, he'll wish he'll be still in San

Antonio for our, for all the booze we'll be getting. Um, but, uh,

ultimately I think why Leonard I'll remember him as a disappointment. Um,

There were some nice moments there. The best singular performance

in Clipper history against the Dallas Mavericks. But I look

back at guys like Chris Paul or Blake Griffin, and

I think those guys did absolutely everything they could to

help the Clippers win. Chris Paul's last season, notwithstanding, which

we're not going to talk about too much, that dude

really laid it all out to change the culture. Kawhi

inherited a culture, and he didn't really move the needle.

And now he set the team back a lot because

of this whole scandal. And I have to give him

some responsibility in the whole thing, despite the fact that

I think that the Clippers should have parented much better.

And it'll affect how I remember Kawhi. And I would not.

mention him. I do think he's the best Clipper player

to ever put on a jersey, but he's not one

that I'll remember as favorably as those two Lob City guys,

that's for sure. Go ahead, Justin.

Speaker 4: You know what?

Speaker 3: One of the things that I was just thinking about

is I completely underrated what leadership meant from your best

players until Kawhi became a Clipper. And, um, you know,

you kind of throughout this era really kind of felt

that like, forget the off the court, um, scandal that, that,

that's followed him. Um, it just never once felt like

he was a leader of men or was that galvanizing

player that everyone wanted to, um, play for. They were

just playing with him. And his talent obviously stood out,

but he never came across as someone who could lead

their team. And when I think about this Kawhi Leonard era,

that's one thing that you'd never really questioned with CP3

during his tenure with the Clippers. Um, you felt like

he was trying to leave, even if it was a

bit abrasive off putting, um, you'd rather have that than

someone who was just completely isolated to himself and not

really trying to, um, be someone that people could get behind.

So that's something that, um, I, I, I just, I

think about too.

Speaker 4: And, um, yeah.

Speaker 5: And, Uncle Dennis, of course. I always think about him

when I think about Kawhi now.

Speaker 1: Absolutely. That's such a good point. I absolutely did also

underrate it. And it was a point that a lot

of people kind of yelled loudly. And I was like, oh,

it doesn't matter. Look at the results. Lead by example, blah, blah, blah. No.

You know why everybody wanted Jimmy Butler over Paul George?

Because Jimmy Butler, for better or for worse, that guy led.

That was a dog. And the Clippers, you know, honestly,

their biggest dog was probably Pat Beverly. When Kawhi Leonard

came to this team, Paul George was in that way.

And I do think that what he really, Kawhi really

should have been recruiting was not somebody who was hyper talented,

that kind of played under his talents, but a guy

like Butler, who is maybe not as talented as Paul George,

but but yelled his talent from, like, the top of

the freaking floor, you know? And....

Speaker 4: Go ahead. My bad. I didn't mean to cut you off.

Speaker 2: No. I'm just thinking the names that you guys are

bringing up right now, Patrick Beverly and Paul George, it

seems like those two are the two guys that are

the most vocally or publicly supportive of Kawhi And when

I'm thinking about his leadership style, it seems like those

two were probably one of two of the few that

come to mind, maybe two of the only that would

fall into that description of like, they would play hard

for Kawhi.

Speaker 4: They would do it for Kawhi. I think it's because

they respected him.

Speaker 2: Like, like he was, you know, like a God or like,

you know, obviously their friendship too, but like, how much

Paul George and Patrick Beverly have gone on these podcasts

and media stuff and kind of just voiced their like

fandom of Kauai.

Speaker 4: But I don't think that's.

Speaker 2: Not like leadership. That's just like being a good basketball player,

a great basketball player that your peers respect. And then

I'm sure there are really good friends as well.

Speaker 4: But then like another name that like.

Speaker 2: I've thought about too, since all this stuff has, has

kind of, you know, we've gotten, we've peeled back the

layers and gotten more stuff is Montrezl Harrell. Like he

was very vocal from his exit. Like, Hey man, these

guys are not doing things the right way. They're, I

don't know if he used the word prima donnas or whatnot.

Speaker 4: But like just soft. Yeah.

Speaker 2: Like, and at the time, lots of Clippers supporters, myself included,

kind of just rolled their eyes at it just because,

you know, Trez was going to the Lakers and there's

probably some bad blood and some animosity there.

Speaker 4: But, like, he.

Speaker 2: Probably is feeling really good today. Like, he knew what

was going on behind the scenes, maybe not to the

extent that Pablo Torre knew, obviously.

Speaker 1: But, like, the treatment of these players. Yeah, man, preferential treatment.

You're right.

Speaker 4: Yeah, like, he was really on to something with that.

Speaker 2: And, you know, I don't know.

Speaker 4: I just.

Speaker 2: was thinking about him the other day for whatever reason.

Maybe I was watching him on like the big three

or something.

Speaker 4: I was like, Oh yeah.

Speaker 2: Like he was kind of ahead of his time with

all of this. And he saw what was going on.

He set the culture, him and Pat and Lou, like

they helped set the culture that Kawhi inherited. Like you said, Justin,

and it just went to a completely different place. I'm

sure that was super disturbing to him and probably felt disrespected.

And I can see why. the ending was what it

was for him as a Clipper.

Speaker 4: Just, yeah, I don't know. I've just been thinking about that.

Speaker 1: Man, that's such a good point. And it really should

have been a red flag to a lot of us.

I was in the locker room right after all that

happened and how kind of awkward it was just talking

to the players. But the fact that these guys, you know,

Pat Bev, Montrose Harrell.

Speaker 4: Lou Williams.

Speaker 1: Lou Williams, who was thrown away for Rajon Rondo and

then immediately played quite well for the Hawks and led

them to some playoff wins himself.

Speaker 5: Conference Finals.

Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah. He needs credit for that. Shout out Lou Williams.

The fact that these guys right away felt a culture

shock to this new guard when the team was the

most talented it's ever been. And then the team self-destructed

in the bubble, whereas a team like the Lakers were

really galvanized by the bubble with a guy like LeBron James.

Say what you will about him. He's led multiple teams

to championships. Whereas a guy like Kawhi Leonard, peak of

his powers– is unable to lift that team. Doc Rivers aside,

don't get me wrong. I think Doc Rivers made huge mistakes.

We can talk about Zoo over Trez against Jokic, all

that stuff. Don't get me wrong. But the way that

team went out was really bad. It was the craziest

way to go out I've ever seen from a favorite

team in a playoff series. I can't remember.

Speaker 4: You know what it is? Yeah.

Speaker 5: You know what it is?

Speaker 3: It's like, and Cole's hooped at the highest of levels,

so you understand this. It means something when your best

player is pouring into you faith that you're actually a

part of this, that you can actually help the team

achieve something. And Kawhi Leonard and Paul George for, for

that matter, just weren't those guys. Like if you're struggling,

they're just, they're not those guys that are going to

just like shout to the heavens, words of encouragement and pour,

pour into you. And that's the level of leadership that

the Clippers never got with those guys. And like, you

felt it, you felt it in the bubble, right? Like

you felt it, you felt it in, in, various other

regular season games of like Paul George and things like that.

We felt it a year ago against the Nuggets.

Speaker 1: We felt it in the play-in game against the Warriors.

Speaker 3: When you get to those moments where you need your teammates,

your teammates aren't there because they've just been watching you.

essentially from afar the entire year even though they're your

teammates they're just watching you be amazing but if you're

not communicating with them if you're not bringing them along

with you then you can't.

Speaker 5: Call call upon them when you.

Speaker 3: Actually need them and vice versa and like that's leadership

that's a big part of leadership and that's something that

um the Clippers missed through the entire 213 era you

know um it's all those little things like I think

James Harden's James Harden got traded to the Clippers and

he did a piece with Ramona on ESPN.

Speaker 5: He's like, I don't know anything about him. I don't

know where he lives.

Speaker 6: And I'm just like, what is going on, dude?

Speaker 1: I get it. I get it. Meanwhile, Shay would have

dinner with Chris Paul during the one year they were

together and they can't stop remembering that time where Shay

was taken in by a guy like Chris. Like, Little

little things like that matter to me, man. Like, you know,

they matter.

Speaker 5: They matter, man.

Speaker 3: And I just and like, you know, I don't know

how we got on to this like tangent about like leadership.

Speaker 5: But like, yeah, if.

Speaker 3: You and it makes it makes sense why someone wouldn't would.

It makes sense why someone wouldn't be able to lead

their financial life when they are so quiet in their.

Speaker 5: Actual job endeavor. You know what I mean?

Speaker 3: It's kind of not that surprising on a macro level.

Speaker 1: Man, that is a fantastic bow, Justin. You've been doing

this too, this podcasting thing. Good full circle moment. Cole,

what are you looking forward to in this season? Let's

close with that. What are you looking forward to? to

the Clippers this coming season with their players and this team?

Speaker 2: Um, I, I don't think they're going to have any

sort of expectations from anyone. Um, I wouldn't say for

the first time in a long time, I think the

last couple of years, it was kind of that, but

there was always the superstar James or the superstar Kawhi

or whatever the case may be. Um, but like in

a somewhat watered down Western conference, um, with some exciting, uh,

younger players. Um, I'm just excited to watch them to hoop,

like without any expectations. I don't know if that ends

up being a playing spot again, or if it ends

up being like the 2018, 2019 season where they find

a little bit of something and start to establish a culture,

but they do have a lot of, um, I won't

say a lot. They do have some interesting pieces that'll

at least make the season fun. It might already be

fun just because it'll be refreshing to have a different

product out there without those expectations. So I think I'm

going to enjoy this season. Ultimately, if they decide to,

if they're even able to start making some moves and

trying to recoup value for guys and plan for the future,

then so be it. That'll be obviously a good business

decisions for the team, but I'm just excited to watch

a fully healthy Darius Garland. See what Keaton Wagler brings

to the table this year in his rookie season. See

how long it takes for him to develop. Even watching

somebody like Rui Hachimura, like if Chris Dunn and Derek

Jones are going to be on the team, if they're

elevated into different roles and whatnot.

Speaker 4: Like, I think it should be a fun unit.

Speaker 2: They're not old. They've got a lot of young legs and,

I don't really know. It's almost like a college basketball

team nowadays where the roster turnover is pretty drastic and

there's not a lot of reps between, you know, the

guys that are going to be making up the bulk

of the rotation minutes. So you kind of don't really

know what to expect. I didn't even mention Brandon Ingram. So, yeah,

I'm just going into it, like, excited to see what

happens because there's honestly no telling what could happen.

Speaker 1: Truly. Justin, are you feeling something similar? Is this, does

this team get you kind of excited or are you

just kind of waiting to see kind of what's going

to happen?

Speaker 4: Yeah.

Speaker 3: I mean, like, I think I differ from, I've been

listening to the last couple of pods with Flam and Lucas.

I think there's a world where this team is a

little bit better than kind of like what they're suggesting.

And that part of it is like, it's fun for me.

Seeing what, garland can do if he's healthy and is

like giving the carte blanche to just go crazy like

um he's a really talented player and he's an incredibly

fun watch with with how quick he is they handle

i don't know that was one of the more pleasant

surprises and pleasant developments last year was watching him up

close like oh this is a fun player to watch

and like if he can get up like eight ten

threes a game who knows you know um they they've

got they've got some pieces the front court is obviously

a complete mess um but i'm i i think there's

a world where this team can be competitive and being

competitive is fun and like we may get to a

point where they pull the cord on things because they

are trying to flip these guys for assets but maybe

not maybe not you know i remember that year where

We juiced up Tobias Harris to a certain point and

then flipped him for assets. Right. So we could we

could end up doing the same thing with Ingram this

year or Rui this year or something like that. But, yeah,

there's a there's a lot to like with this team.

I'm really disappointed about the Jordan Miller injury.

Speaker 5: That was like one of my potential.

Speaker 3: That was one of my potential breakout candidates for the

Clippers this year. Um, if he had gotten like real minutes,

it felt like this was a potential 15, 16 point

per game guy, um, who could always generate a pain

touch for the Clippers, the decel slow step around the rim.

He was just really disappointed to, um, to see that.

Speaker 5: But, um, yeah.

Speaker 3: And I think Cole mentioned, uh, Wagler's potential developmental arc.

That's something that you want to watch him and once

Gianna gets back. So yeah, I think there's enough here

that the Clippers could be fun. Now, there's obviously the

downside to where it could get ugly really, really fast.

And for Clipper fans, this is going to be the

first time in a very long time where there ain't

no Kawhi Leonard. There ain't even a Paul George here.

Speaker 6: So it could get.

Speaker 3: It could get ugly really fast you know the Clippers

for all of their um for all of their misfortunes

in recent memory um you've seen Russell Westbrook you've seen

Kawhi Leonard you've seen James Harden you've seen Paul George

all suit up for the Clippers in this like over

the last like six seven years and that's not there

anymore that's not there anymore and that could be like

a humbling experience, but I'm optimistic that that won't be

the case.

Speaker 5: So like I'm, I'm, I'm ready. I'm ready. I'm really, I'm,

I'm already.

Speaker 3: Ready for a preseason basketball. I'm ready to see if

the Clippers can do what they always do in these

transition eras, which is play some competitive basketball and aim

towards 500.

Speaker 4: Yeah.

Speaker 1: No, no, quiet Leonard, no James Harden, but we still

have Chris Dunn. So don't worry about it. That'll do it.

for this episode of The Law of the Gem, the podcast.

You know, I think that this was a lot of

great venting. And, you know, we're also Clipper fans. I'm

always going to be a Clipper fan. And I am

very intrigued by what's coming up. Shout out Jordan Miller.

I mean, watching him last year was such.

It was so cool to see this guy who... Felt

like he had kind of lost some confidence when I

had so much stock in him being a glue guy.

And then changing his game to just being this kind

of almost like a bowling ball, able to touch the

paint whenever he wanted. Just kind of neglecting his three-point

shot entirely, which I thought would be the shot he

needed to translate. And just redefining his game as a

guy that gets to the paint or dies trying. Shout

out Ty Lue. I hope we get, I mean, I

don't anticipate we see much of him F at all

this year. I hope that that six month range reevaluation period,

I would love to get some Jordan Miller time in there,

but I am quite bummed about him because, you know,

the Clippers have some young guys, you have Miller, you know,

you have Kobe, Kobe Sanders, you got Yannick, who hopefully

will come back by the end of the year and

have some reps and Wagler. I'm excited to see if

he takes strides to the point where he demands to

be started. There are things to be excited about here,

which makes this whole thing a huge bummer because I

think the Clippers were building back real quick here with

some degree of aptitude. And then you read these pages

that make you feel like aptitude is the last word

to be put with them. But just like we had

been doing for so long, the players don't deserve to

be penalized. And If you're a Clipper fan, you've got

to get behind them because I think that this will

be an easy team to root for. um and you

know i i think the further we get from this

verdict and hopefully some admission of guilt uh the further

the team can kind of watch hopefully uh some rebuilt

equity and not equity for just rebuilt good vibes um

that have been lost in a little bit of a

gut punch of a summer. So I think that'll do

it for this episode. Justin Cole, uh, we'll have you

guys on sooner than later, uh, to talk about these

new Clippers and hopefully, you know, just to talk about basketball, um,

cause we all love basketball and we'll continue to love basketball.

Leave us a nice five star review, whatever platform this

is on five stars, five stars really helps some nice

words too. We'll read them on the air. And as

always go Clippers. Thank you.