Mansfield Park Volume 2 Chapter 13

We have a PROPOSAL (Graham, the sound effect)!!! We learn the real reason Henry went to London, Fanny doubts Henry's intentions, Henry comes to dinner, and Mary and Fanny exchange letters.

Topics discussed include the Crawfords' breeding and capacity for change, Fanny's sleep paralysis demon, leaving unpleasant conversations, Lady Bertram's privilege, Fanny's OOO message, and the ultimate question of why Henry is in love with Fanny.

A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms spoilers 39:55-42:15!!!

Patron Study Questions come from Avi, Linnea, and Emily. Topics discussed include Mary's intimacy with Fanny and whether it's genuine, William's promotion and whether Henry is using it to manipulate Fanny, and whether the family will find out about the proposal.

Becca's Study Questions: Topics discussed include how this proposal is different from other proposals, why Henry proposed at this moment, what William's promotion means for Fanny, and the end of Volume II.

Funniest Quote: While her heart was still bounding with joy and gratitude on William’s behalf, she could not be severely resentful of anything that injured only herself; and after having twice drawn back her hand, and twice attempted in vain to turn away from him, she got up, and said only, with much agitation, “Don’t, Mr. Crawford, pray don’t! I beg you would not. This is a sort of talking which is very unpleasant to me. I must go away. I cannot bear it.”

Questions moving forward: Will Henry try again? Will he change? What will happen with Mary and Edmund?

Who wins the chapters? Fanny AND William!

Glossary of People, Places, and Things: Avatar: The Last Airbender, A Midsummer Night's Dream, A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms, The Mandalorian, Aladdin, Falling For Christmas, The Good Place

Next Episode: Mansfield Park Volume III Chapter 1

Our show art was created by Torrence Browne, and our audio is produced by Graham Cook. For bios and transcripts, check out our website at podandprejudice.com. Pod and Prejudice is transcribed by speechdocs.com. To support the show, check out our Patreon! Check out our merch at https://podandprejudice.dashery.com.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Hey everyone, before we begin today, we'd like to thank our newest patrons, Kate, staff, and Courtney.

[SPEAKER_02]: Welcome to the team.

[SPEAKER_02]: And now, enjoy this week's episode, covering volume two chapter 13 of Mansfield Park.

[SPEAKER_00]: Mansfield Park is fun because it's like you drive 20 miles an hour for like 200 pages, and then suddenly you just zoom up to 80 and you're like, oh, you look like a flash.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yep, we are entering volume three is going to be a banger.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, there's lots to discuss, lots to unpack, lots to dissect, what are what are what are what are we going to be doing?

[SPEAKER_02]: We're gonna be eating up, cutting into the steak, and eating it up.

[SPEAKER_00]: Savoring the juicy tendrils, lapping up the water.

[SPEAKER_02]: No.

[SPEAKER_00]: There's more so tired.

[SPEAKER_00]: We're doing great.

[SPEAKER_00]: We're doing fantastic.

[SPEAKER_00]: So this is Becca.

[SPEAKER_00]: This is Molly.

[SPEAKER_00]: We are here to talk about Jane Austen.

[SPEAKER_00]: We are here specifically to talk about Mansfield Park.

[SPEAKER_00]: Listeners, if you're new here, I Becca have read many Jane Austen novels through my lifetime.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I'm Ali, I'm reading all of her works for the first time through this podcast.

[SPEAKER_00]: If you want to hear Molly read through Pet Impregidist, since in sensibility, Emma or persuasion for the first time, you can listen to seasons 1, 2, 3, and 4 of this podcast, respectively, but that is not what we're doing here today.

[SPEAKER_02]: No, today we are talking about Mansfield Park, volume 2, chapter 13, or if your book is not broken up in volumes that is chapter 31.

[SPEAKER_00]: And we need to address this listeners because I realized later and by I realized Molly told me that we were actually at the end of volume the second and I had thought it was coming later so I was not prepared so I did assign Molly the two chapters keeping in mind what happens in the next chapter.

[SPEAKER_00]: But given that is the end of a volume and given the events of this chapter, we decided to keep it to one this week.

[SPEAKER_00]: So that's why it's different than what it says in our preview.

[SPEAKER_00]: So just be prepared for us to talk about one chapter at this week.

[SPEAKER_02]: I feel very excited for whatever is coming in the next chapter that it needed to like keep going into that.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, I'm not going to tell you anything about what happens towards the end of this book, but we've we've been planting so many seeds and it's kind of like I feel like we've been doing the fall planting and now we're in spring and things are beginning to grow.

[SPEAKER_00]: things are sprouting, things are sprouting.

[SPEAKER_00]: And now we're going to see what blooms here or rots depending on what way the pot may or may not go.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: So should we tell them where we left off?

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, we sure will.

[SPEAKER_00]: So basically, Fanny is hanging around Edmund's gone.

[SPEAKER_00]: He's getting his orders.

[SPEAKER_00]: Mary's overthinking that.

[SPEAKER_00]: And Henry Crawford has come back to Man's field park and told his sister, he's in love with Fanny, price, and he intends to marry her.

[SPEAKER_00]: And you were probably wondering how she's going to go about confessing that to Fanny.

[SPEAKER_02]: And that's what we get in this.

[SPEAKER_00]: You sure didn't have to wait long.

[SPEAKER_00]: Did you?

[SPEAKER_02]: Not at all.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: So Henry comes over very early one morning while Fanny and Lady Bertram are still having breakfast, which is earlier than societal norms.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, normally.

[SPEAKER_02]: Allow.

[SPEAKER_02]: But luckily, Lady Bertrim has just gotten up to leave, and I loved this.

[SPEAKER_02]: It was like, she had exerted herself enough to go to the door.

[SPEAKER_02]: She wasn't going to turn around in this moon.

[SPEAKER_02]: So she leaves and Henry is thrilled to be alone with Fanny.

[SPEAKER_02]: He has news to share.

[SPEAKER_00]: And what is his news?

[SPEAKER_02]: His news is that her brother has been made lieutenant.

[SPEAKER_00]: Her brother has been made a lieutenant.

[SPEAKER_02]: Reading this, it was like all of these blocks that were floating around of my brain.

[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know why it's blocks.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's like a Rubik's Cube.

[SPEAKER_02]: They just all snapped into place.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you kind of called this, too.

[SPEAKER_00]: Did I?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you said you thought Henry was going to go to London and help William get to know the admiral.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, yes.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, because it said that he was going to, well, he invited him to dinner with the admiral.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I guess, yes, without consciously thinking like he's going to get him promoted, I did think he wanted to improve William social standing, particularly with the admiral who at that point I hadn't figured out was their uncle, their uncle, but who's an admiral and so it does make sense that he would be trying to promote him with an admiral in the Navy because he needed a raise.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we talked about who gets promoted in the Navy and it's all about the connections you have and William has connections, but this is a juicy plum to pick for him and here we are, William has now graduated to the tenant, which is

[SPEAKER_00]: What a quite a step up for our guy, William.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, it's what we were talking about at the ball where he was like, normally, I don't get danced with because I'm not a lieutenant.

[SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.

[SPEAKER_02]: So now he gets to get dances.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_02]: Suck a girl.

[SPEAKER_02]: So that's why he went.

[SPEAKER_02]: And we're going to hear about that in more detail soon.

[SPEAKER_02]: But he gives Fanny three letters, which are essentially his like, here's the proof.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: He's coming like dancing into the room being like,

[SPEAKER_02]: But I, yeah, it was cute, is that like he, when he describes it to her later, he's like, or in a couple of paragraphs, he's like, I was devastated that I had to come home before I had secured the bag, like that I couldn't, because he had gone and he was like, I wanna have come home with good news.

[SPEAKER_00]: But why did he come home early, does he say?

[SPEAKER_02]: he says that there had been too many delays like there was a party or a thing or this person was going to that thing and they weren't able to like link up all of the people that needed to link up to me.

[SPEAKER_00]: But why did he have to come back?

[SPEAKER_02]: He doesn't say, but my guess is that he misses his girlfriend.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's basically he was like, I missed you.

[SPEAKER_00]: I couldn't stay away.

[SPEAKER_00]: Ridiculous.

[SPEAKER_00]: I believe it was this man went from like horrible flirt to pathetic in like two seconds.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's ridiculous.

[SPEAKER_02]: I have a lot of thoughts about it that we will talk about as we go.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, I love it.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I have thoughts.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, yeah, I think we can take this in two steads.

[SPEAKER_00]: There are two paths going on at the same time that our heads and our hearts, I think.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, and I think you and I agree that there is like there is a lot wrong with what's about to happen.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_01]: But he's also kind of hot.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_02]: 100%.

[SPEAKER_02]: Actually, this is a good time to bring up something that our listeners brought up after our last episode.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_02]: When Mary said that when Henry no longer loves Fannie, he'll still be a good gentleman towards her.

[SPEAKER_02]: I took that and said that he wasn't going to cheat on Fannie, like the admiral cheated on his wife and was cruel to her.

[SPEAKER_02]: Where our listeners came back and said it's not that Mary doesn't think he's going to do any of that.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's that he won't be cruel to her about it.

[SPEAKER_02]: So he wouldn't be like publicly shaming her.

[SPEAKER_02]: He wouldn't be kind of casting her aside.

[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe like potentially being like cruel emotionally or physically in ways that we don't know.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, more so that he, like, he's still going to have affairs, but that it's more commonly accepted to do so as long as you're discreet about it and he'll be discreet.

[SPEAKER_00]: I like this interpretation because I think it wins some reasoning to Mary's draw to Edmund.

[SPEAKER_00]: Because if there's a man, say what you want about Edmund Bertram and boy, do we?

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, that man's not going to cheat on anybody.

[SPEAKER_00]: No, like that man.

[SPEAKER_00]: That man's a executive marriage.

[SPEAKER_00]: That man is staying within the confines of Managami and also like he is like a good sturdy solid person.

[SPEAKER_00]: So like if I mean it's there have been some of our listeners did bring up the notion that it's possibly admiral was physically or emotionally cruel.

[SPEAKER_00]: and violent with his wife.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that's that's an interesting interpretation and I what makes sense about it to me is Mary being drawn to such a gentle and sort of like rules driven guy like Edmund Bertram, who is just like the exact opposite of her father for your who she despises.

[SPEAKER_02]: And so to do we think that she really thinks that Henry will not turn out just like the admiral

[SPEAKER_02]: I don't trust that he's not gonna end up like the admiral in what regard it comes up later But he talks about how the admiral is the best man.

[SPEAKER_02]: He knows and I think that's really sad And I think that if that's his one Father figure that he's ever known there's a high potential that he doesn't know any better

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not going to comment too heavily on this, except to say the both Mary and Henry were raised by the admiral and his wife, and I think that is a through line of this book that both Fanny and Edmund constantly talk about that these Crawfords don't have good breeding.

[SPEAKER_00]: That's what they mean.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: These two people don't know how to fuck and behave themselves.

[SPEAKER_00]: But I think the question is, how much are they formed by that bad breeding and how much are they their own people who have this capacity to be human and love and change?

[SPEAKER_02]: Mm-hmm, and I really hope Henry has the capacity to change because I love this love story for Fanny.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, let's keep going.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes,

[SPEAKER_02]: Henry watches Fanny's face while she's digesting this.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is actually very sweet.

[SPEAKER_00]: So like not to pull us back into Avatar for a second.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh my god, listeners, we were just watching Avatar right before we recorded.

[SPEAKER_00]: This is relevant because without giving too much away, just so everyone knows Molly just watched the Avatar on the Firelord, which is a big plot twisty episode.

[SPEAKER_00]: And the joy, I...

[SPEAKER_00]: died from watching you watch that and like the look of like on your face and like the joy I get just like sharing this podcast with you is like someone I love who's getting to experience like pleasurable things like and I get to like witness the joy on your face like there's me so beautiful about giving someone joy that you want to see happy and that's what Henry has done here yes oh

[SPEAKER_02]: That's cute.

[SPEAKER_00]: We'll get it to the darker side of it, but yeah, yes, yes, yes.

[SPEAKER_02]: So Henry says that he only thought of her happiness when he found out and so he had to come as fast as he could.

[SPEAKER_02]: He really wanted her to be the first to know, in fact he even grudged himself knowing before a fanty knew he wanted to tell fanty so fast.

[SPEAKER_02]: He felt terrible that this wasn't finalized before he left London, and as we talked about, he left because he missed her.

[SPEAKER_02]: And he talks about how his uncle, like we just talked about, is the very best person in the world, and he really loved William, and Henry has been hesitant until now to say how much his uncle loved William, because he didn't want to jinx it.

[SPEAKER_02]: But now that it's proven how much he loved him by the promotion, he can tell her that his uncle

[SPEAKER_02]: And Fanny is speechless and is kind of slowly the cogs in her brain are slowly coming together.

[SPEAKER_02]: She's like, what is going on?

[SPEAKER_00]: It's taking a minute, but the thing she knows Williams would be hoping for forever, that she was expecting to get years down the line for him or never at all.

[SPEAKER_00]: Henry Crawford just walked into the dining room and handed her a letter and said, guess what?

[SPEAKER_00]: he's got it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Your brother is moving up in society.

[SPEAKER_00]: The one thing that almost nobody does around here.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: And at this point is when she's like, you did this?

[SPEAKER_02]: And he's like, he's like, oh, I sure to.

[SPEAKER_02]: He's like, loving to tell you exactly how it happened.

[SPEAKER_02]: How my only reason for going to London was to introduce William to my uncle.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I didn't tell anyone because I didn't want to jinx it, but I was going solely to get him promoted.

[SPEAKER_02]: And as he's telling her this, he quote, used such strong expressions was so abounding in the deepest interest in two fold motives in views and wishes more than could be told.

[SPEAKER_02]: That Fanny could not have remained insensible of his drift had she been able to attend.

[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm picturing this where Fanny's got these letters in her hand and she's just like running around the room and he's like, and so, you know, I did this thinking of not only William, but maybe somebody else in Fanny's like,

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, exactly.

[SPEAKER_02]: She is not paying attention at all.

[SPEAKER_02]: Not at all.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I also love the phrase that catch my drift has been around for 200 years.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's one of those things we're like, you read a Shakespeare play and they're slang that we still use over it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: So, Fanny is so overwhelmed with joy and surprise.

[SPEAKER_02]: And she turns to Henry, and she's like, we are infinitely obliged to you.

[SPEAKER_02]: I gotta go tell my uncle, and she gets up to go, and he takes her hand and pulls her back, saying, give me five more minutes.

[SPEAKER_00]: Have you ever had the moment where he realized someone's hitting on you?

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: And you didn't realize before.

[SPEAKER_02]: And you didn't want that.

[SPEAKER_02]: And you're like, oh, no.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's what's happening here.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to read it because I thought it was so funny.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, quite exquisitely written.

[SPEAKER_02]: He was in the middle of his further explanation before she had suspected for what she was detained.

[SPEAKER_02]: When she did understand it, however, and found herself expected to believe that she had created some sessions, which his heart had never known before.

[SPEAKER_02]: and that everything he had done for William was to be placed to the account of his excessive and unequal detachment to her, she was exceedingly distressed and for some moments unable to speak.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yikes!

[SPEAKER_00]: So like in this moment Henry has taken this moment of joy he has given Fanny and said,

[SPEAKER_00]: I can't help myself.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm obsessed with you.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love you.

[SPEAKER_00]: Let's get fucking married.

[SPEAKER_00]: And then Fanny is like, wait, what?

[SPEAKER_00]: And then like you just see her like freeze and like she's like in a sleep paralysis moment.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and he's her sleep paralysis demon.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's really good.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: So listeners, maybe it's because recently Becca and I, along with friend of the Pogs Aquia Simone sat down and read a bit of our nice dream, just for funsies, which I first of all highly recommend doing with your friends.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's still like full so fun.

[SPEAKER_02]: She does not believe that he is being serious and it is very hell on a code and a code.

[SPEAKER_00]: She says, oh, spite.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, how I see your world bent to set against me for your marriage.

[SPEAKER_00]: I had the same exact thought you did.

[SPEAKER_00]: I was like, this is deep Helena in this moment.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because she's never been the subject of anyone's admiration before and it's not only that it she's the subject of somebody's admiration,

[SPEAKER_00]: and valuation.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like he's like, it meant somewhere's a good comp because it is as if he is bewitched.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, yeah, she has seen him dance around ruining her cousins and like loudly profess the most insane shit.

[SPEAKER_00]: And here he is saying, like, you have taken me.

[SPEAKER_00]: in a way that no woman ever could.

[SPEAKER_00]: What is it exactly?

[SPEAKER_02]: He says here that she had created sensations which his heart had never known before and that everything he had done for William was to be placed on the account of his excessive and unequal that attachment to her.

[SPEAKER_02]: But the thing about it is that she

[SPEAKER_02]: watch him say these kinds of things or not say he didn't he's never said these kinds of things before she's watched him mess with her cousins for for the bit flirting for the bit and never could have thought he would be capable he she doesn't think he's capable of love so then to see him turn on her and claim to be in love with her she has no choice but to believe that he is flirting with her for the bit.

[SPEAKER_02]: and that he's taken it too far.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I completely agree with her standpoint on this, or she's like, no, she says, no, no, you gotta stone that down, but she, that and that's what the whole chapter is.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's her thinking, oh, it was bite oh hell.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so she's annoyed, but she can't get too angry because of course she is still happy about William.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's a trap because

[SPEAKER_00]: She's too, it's too big a thing.

[SPEAKER_00]: He just did for her.

[SPEAKER_00]: She's too grateful and it's like pretty It isn't it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we'll get to it, but like there are a lot of things around this whole William thing I have very mixed feelings about it because some of it is just like we'll get to another study questions Henry Crawford did the thing for William that his uncle who's a baronet did not do like

[SPEAKER_00]: he did something extraordinary for the young man's life that is going to transform the price family and he did it so that Fanny can be

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, here's the the thing is it's like it's hard to say because again, I do think in his core Henry does not believe it's possible for any price to refuse him because she's so poor and ill connected and he is such a good fit for her like a good match like he doesn't I don't know if he even presume she could say no to him here.

[SPEAKER_00]: but he's put her in a position where she can't just be rude to him about it.

[SPEAKER_00]: She can't like refuse him.

[SPEAKER_00]: She is trapped by society's norms of what a woman of her prospects must accept.

[SPEAKER_00]: And also by the fact that he just changed her family's whole life and like circumstance.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's a really tough, tough thing for our guy Henry Crawford.

[SPEAKER_02]: because Fannie doesn't believe that he's serious, she doesn't have that, um, she can't get outwardly angry at him though.

[SPEAKER_02]: She can't get angry at him, but she can refuse him in this moment.

[SPEAKER_02]: And that is precisely what happens.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, she says, please don't do that.

[SPEAKER_02]: This kind of conversation is very unpleasant to me, which I think is iconic behavior.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just going to start saying that to people this kind of conversation is very unpleasant to me.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I don't want to discuss this right.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we are allowed to just be straightforward about that sort of thing and just pull a fanny price.

[SPEAKER_00]: In the year of our Lord in 2026, we could all stand be a bit more fanny price about not having to talk about things that just simply

[SPEAKER_02]: are horrendous to talk about agreed so she's like I got to go but he continues and he proposes Graham the sound effect he proposes he says I offer myself my hand my fortune

[SPEAKER_01]: Hi friends, you're a Raj band with a face free shot.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh god.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh no.

[SPEAKER_02]: You're a bright red.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, I'm flush.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like the thing is I'm blushing.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh my god.

[SPEAKER_02]: So she can barely stand with the shock of it, much like me.

[SPEAKER_02]: And he's like, well, what do you say?

[SPEAKER_02]: And she covers her face in embarrassment.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I picture her like, speaking through her hands like this.

[SPEAKER_02]: And she's like, no, no, no, this is nonsense.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm thankful for what you've done for William, but I do not want, I cannot bear.

[SPEAKER_02]: I must not listen to such, no, no, don't think of me.

[SPEAKER_02]: But you're not thinking of me.

[SPEAKER_02]: I know you're not and she calls him out and says you're not being serious right now

[SPEAKER_02]: At that moment, Sir Thomas is heard coming towards them and she uses this as a chance to escape.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_02]: So she runs out the far end of the room, just as Sir Thomas comes in and she's like pacing back and forth in the east room.

[SPEAKER_02]: Meanwhile, Henry thinks that it's her modesty that's keeping her from answering right now.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, exactly.

[SPEAKER_00]: Very, very Collins coded in the moment.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, a woman for her own modesty must refuse once or twice.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, which is like I'm so glad at least I hope I don't know people who are still in the dating pool you can tell me if I'm wrong, but I think that this died in the year like 1892 or something.

[SPEAKER_00]: It did not die in the year 1892.

[SPEAKER_00]: The question is whether it died in the year like 2017 and I didn't I don't know.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean when I was still in the dating pool, it still existed, but it was like.

[SPEAKER_00]: waning.

[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if it has come back with a vengeance or not, but back in the day where men were like, ah yeah, she's playing hard to get.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh yeah, that was a phrase.

[SPEAKER_00]: This was all over the place like pulling pig tails.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, oh, if she doesn't want to talk to you, like, like, just keep going and persist eventually you'll wear her down.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: These are sentiments that persist to this day.

[SPEAKER_00]: This sentiment has not died.

[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know how prevalent it is.

[SPEAKER_00]: Our listeners in the dating pool will have to tell us if the last 10 years have been an advancement.

[SPEAKER_00]: On this front, I hope so.

[SPEAKER_02]: I hope so for all of your sex.

[SPEAKER_02]: Gosh, Henry Crawford, man, I'm just thinking about it and like he is truly a tornado of a person.

[SPEAKER_00]: There is very little between me feeling like deeply drawn to him as a character and feeling like insufferably furious with him and there's so little in between.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I like find myself making excuses for him in my head.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, isn't that crazy?

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: So, she is up in her feelings.

[SPEAKER_02]: She is agitated, happy, miserable, infinitely obliged, and absolutely angry.

[SPEAKER_02]: She knows that this is his nature.

[SPEAKER_02]: He can do nothing without a little bit of evil being involved.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's basically like, why do you have to ruin everything?

[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, this was a good thing you did.

[SPEAKER_00]: This was a good thing you did, and now you've ruined it with your little bit of evil.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you're big, throbbing evil.

[SPEAKER_00]: I do think it's interesting that she thinks this is typical of him because this is very different than what he was doing with Mariah and Julia.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's different, but she thinks of it as having the same heart, which is bad, bad, and also flirting for the bit.

[SPEAKER_00]: It is definitely flirting for the bit, however, this is like what I find interesting about it is that the flirting for the bit between Mariah and Julia is that he had just kept on to a tiny handle of plausible deniability.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, and he doesn't have that here, but I think that for her, it's trying to get a girl to fall in love with him.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's the same.

[SPEAKER_00]: Or like, just not taking seriously the notion of romance and marriage and like vows and bonds between people.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, kind of like, a little un-Christian, if you will.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, yes, very.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, he is known to be un-Christian,

[SPEAKER_02]: She doesn't want him to be serious like because she doesn't want to marry him, but at the same time how can she forgive him if he isn't back just fucking around?

[SPEAKER_02]: So there are two wolves inside of her.

[SPEAKER_00]: Inside every fan he priced there are two wolves.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah on the one hand like if you were seriously in love with her that would be unpleasant to her but at least he wouldn't be fucking around so hard with her feelings.

[SPEAKER_02]: So either way it's kind of bad.

[SPEAKER_02]: So instead she chooses to focus on the happiness of William becoming a lieutenant.

[SPEAKER_02]: And besides, fany things to herself, surely Henry will never try that again.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, like that was crazy.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, what a weird slip of judgment on his part.

[SPEAKER_01]: What a, what a fever dream I just lived through.

[SPEAKER_01]: William will be a lieutenant.

[SPEAKER_01]: Also something else may have happened.

[SPEAKER_01]: Who knows, I have compartmentalized it in teeny tiny little box.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, she's good at that sort of thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.

[SPEAKER_02]: So she waits until she's sure that he's left, until she goes downstairs to rejoice with Sir Thomas about.

[SPEAKER_02]: the promotion of William, and she's thrilled until she finds out that Henry is coming back to dying with them later, because of course he is.

[SPEAKER_02]: When he arrives, he comes straight over to her and gives her a letter from Mary, and boy, and boy.

[SPEAKER_02]: Before she opens the letter, she is like looking around, she can look anywhere but Henry, and this man is completely unaware that she is uncomfortable,

[SPEAKER_00]: One of the two.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm choosing to believe that he's unaware that she's uncomfortable and he's taking her like looking away as Blushing and being like coy ladies in their sensitivity ladies and their sensitivities But in fact she is deeply uncomfortable and that happens a lot in the rest of this chapter So now this letter from Mary Mary wants Fannie to know that she fully approves of the match and she gives her consent for Fannie to marry her brother Which if you take it from Mary's perspective

[SPEAKER_00]: makes a little sense.

[SPEAKER_00]: Sure.

[SPEAKER_00]: They're supposedly friends.

[SPEAKER_00]: They're friendemies.

[SPEAKER_00]: They're friendemies, and also like it's a little bit of a disc.

[SPEAKER_00]: Fanny is kind of beneath them.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: So it's kind of a, he's kind of stupid.

[SPEAKER_00]: But she's like, don't worry about that.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm in favor of this because he's in love with you.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: And another thing about that, I think it comes up later.

[SPEAKER_02]: But like the fact that she is below him, I think is a big part of why she's like this has to be a joke.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's a big part of it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Um, like, it's not as though Fanny is so hideous or poor in personality.

[SPEAKER_00]: She's obviously a pretty gross, obviously is very sweet, very like a blind jing.

[SPEAKER_00]: But in this time period, the economics of

[SPEAKER_00]: that your dating pool is your socio-economic class.

[SPEAKER_00]: And Fanny is kind of on the edge.

[SPEAKER_00]: They're like, she has this good connection with the barren head, but she does not have a dowry.

[SPEAKER_00]: So, so it would be, I don't know actually if Sir Thomas ever did you get one.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but she likes her at this point.

[SPEAKER_00]: But she is a bad birth.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: And like, she does not come with great prospects.

[SPEAKER_00]: So it is like stupid for him.

[SPEAKER_00]: So what she's saying is like, you, the cynical bastard who I've seen like toy with women who are twice as conventionally attractive to me and like four times as rich.

[SPEAKER_00]: What do you do it?

[SPEAKER_00]: Why are you doing this with me?

[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

[SPEAKER_00]: I, I am nobody.

[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: So this letter made me cackle and this is upsetting to Fanny because this makes us seem like Ms. Crawford thinks that her brother is in fact serious and is in love with her.

[SPEAKER_00]: Does she not entertain?

[SPEAKER_00]: I don't remember precisely, but I thought she entertained the notion that Mary was in on the joke.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, to me, this red is like, uh, law I see she is one of this confederance.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, would like like the, I thought we were hosts before Browse girl.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah, I think that that is kind of what she thinks.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'll pull it up.

[SPEAKER_00]: For those of you who don't understand the misamernate stream references apologies, we are, and this is well documented massive dorks.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and just to give the briefest of overviews, Helena is tall and slightly homelier than the cute adorable tiny little Hermia and Helena is in love with Demetrius and Hermia and Lysander running off together, but in the woods.

[SPEAKER_00]: I think like the most important thing for this to know is that there are four lovers.

[SPEAKER_00]: Helena is not loved by anyone until a bunch of little pixies in the woods But which the both men to fall in love with her and who is not who is not used to any intention from these guys is like Nope, you are both making fun of me and then Hermia is so confused and Helen is like, oh, I guess you're with the men making fun of me.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you're supposed to be my best friend and you're

[SPEAKER_02]: being a douchebag.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: So that is why we are using that as a reference.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_02]: Fanny's thoughts after reading the letter were these were not expressions to do Fanny any good for though she read in too much haste and confusion to form the clearest judgment of Miss Crawford's meaning it was evident that she meant to complement her on her brother's attachment and even to appear italicized to believe it's serious.

[SPEAKER_02]: She did not know what to do or what to think.

[SPEAKER_02]: There was wretchedness in the idea of it's being serious.

[SPEAKER_02]: There was perplexity and agitation every way.

[SPEAKER_02]: She was distressed whenever Mr. Carverd spoke to her, and he spoke to her much too often.

[SPEAKER_02]: And she was afraid there was something in his voice and manner in addressing her very different from what they were when they talked to others.

[SPEAKER_00]: So she's had the Rose decision goggles taken off, and now she's like, oh no!

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, he's actually, he's like talking to me differently than everybody else.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: What's happening here?

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's going on.

[SPEAKER_02]: Is it, is it for real?

[SPEAKER_02]: Or is he taking this joke way too far?

[SPEAKER_02]: She doesn't know what to think.

[SPEAKER_02]: At dinner, she can't eat because she is so anxious and Sir Thomas.

[SPEAKER_00]: Girl same.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, Sir Thomas commons on how her joy over Williams promotion must have taken away her appetite.

[SPEAKER_02]: And she's mortified because she's like, oh my god, Henry is going to think that that is true.

[SPEAKER_02]: What it's really my anxiety over the fact that he is sitting right there and looking at me.

[SPEAKER_01]: No, no, it's not actually just pure joy.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's actually sheer panic.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_02]: The dinner drags on.

[SPEAKER_02]: And Fanny is more silent than she has ever been, which is a real regression on our girls part.

[SPEAKER_02]: And finally, the women retired to the drawing room where Mrs. Norris and Lady Bertram can discuss Williams promotion and Fanny can deep dive into her feelings.

[SPEAKER_00]: And Mrs. Norris takes no credit whatsoever.

[SPEAKER_02]: No, of course.

[SPEAKER_02]: And she's, she's thrilled that Sir Thomas and herself will no longer have to give William such presence, such generous gifts because he'll be able to pay for his own way in the world.

[SPEAKER_02]: She is very glad that she had given such a substantial parting gift because he's going to need it to furnish his lieutenant's quarters.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: And Lady Bird from is like, Oh, I'm glad you gave him something considerable.

[SPEAKER_02]: I only gave him 10 pounds, which in this time period is a lot.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: So I think like in the equivalent Mrs. Norris maybe gave him like 50 pens or something.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, yeah, she went real stingy and lady birch and was like, oh no, what if she gave him 50 pounds?

[SPEAKER_02]: I don't like even 10.

[SPEAKER_02]: She's like, Sir Thomas said that 10 would be enough and Mrs. Norris is like, let's talk about something else.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh my god.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is like the equivalent I looked it up of probably like 700 in today's money.

[SPEAKER_00]: Imagine having a rich uncle just like hand you $700 randomly.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean as a gift for your promotion.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, it was pre-promotion, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: But still, I mean, they don't see him very often.

[SPEAKER_00]: They're not going to send him random, maybe they do send him random letters, filled money out of them.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think the implication here is that Sir Thomas does, because Lady Mrs. Norris is like, Sir Thomas won't have to pave his way anymore.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, yeah, I mean, there's a real question.

[SPEAKER_00]: So for Fanny, it's very obvious that he pays a ton for Fanny.

[SPEAKER_00]: Let's give us Fanny so much money in the form of room in board.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: For William, I don't know how much this is Mrs. Norris griping and how much of this is accurate, because William lives on a ship.

[SPEAKER_00]: Her Majesty's Royal Navy, I guess it's his Majesty's at this point in time, the Royal Navy pays for William, usually.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I guess over the years or but yeah, I mean, I'm sure that like he's given William money over the years, but I got him his original appointment.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, no, he he's mostly taken advantage of his own connections on Williams behalf more so than like supported him and fed him.

[SPEAKER_00]: William has been making his own money that being said, like they're obviously are like things that would bring him up in the world that I'm sure that

[SPEAKER_02]: And Mrs. Norris says, how much young people cost their friends, like who knows how much these two children, the price kids have cost their Thomas over the years, not to mention all.

[SPEAKER_02]: I do for them.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's Mrs. Norris.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I also pay with my time and patience.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, yes, constantly.

[SPEAKER_02]: Meanwhile, Lady Bertram is hoping that William gets sent to the East Indies so that she can have her shawl.

[SPEAKER_02]: She wants him to buy for her.

[SPEAKER_02]: Now, I found this comment jarring because like this man is in the navy, likely going off to either war or occupy places, and the privilege to be like, oh, I hope you get sent to the East Indies so that I can have a nice shawl.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yep, ridiculous.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think Jane Austen agrees with you.

[SPEAKER_00]: Lady Bertrim, not aware of her own privilege, as you know, to be like, oh, yeah, he gets to travel so much as part of the Navy.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's kind of like, I mean, it's literally like saying, always getting shipped overseas, I hope he brings me back a souvenir.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's exactly that.

[SPEAKER_00]: So that stared me in the face.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, sometimes Jane Austen does want you to remember that these people have built their wealth on the back of the British Empire and the subjects of the British Empire.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Meanwhile, Fanny is still trying to figure out what the Crawford siblings angle is.

[SPEAKER_02]: She is wondering how she possibly could have caught the interest of such a horrible flirt because he has flirted with many beautiful and superior women and seemed immune to catching feelings for any of them.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yep.

[SPEAKER_02]: It says quote, he who was everything to everybody and seemed to find

[SPEAKER_00]: good line.

[SPEAKER_02]: Really good line.

[SPEAKER_00]: Sick burn.

[SPEAKER_00]: It raises the question why again.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I think it's the central question to this part of the book.

[SPEAKER_00]: Why does he fall for her?

[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.

[SPEAKER_00]: I can't answer it right now.

[SPEAKER_00]: Why?

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, know it.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, in all of the other Jane Austen novels, when we have seen people fall in love.

[SPEAKER_00]: We can see why we can relate to why we understand what they're going through.

[SPEAKER_00]: You have like not to run through our whole repertoire, but just for a few examples.

[SPEAKER_00]: Lizzie and Darcy, you see Darcy being challenged for the first time in his freaking life.

[SPEAKER_00]: and Lizzie being challenged for the first time in her freaking life and the challenge that they give to each other is enough to build sexual tension.

[SPEAKER_00]: In Emma, you have nightly and Emma who have know each other better than they know their own souls.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, and that draws them closer together.

[SPEAKER_00]: Anne and Wentworth are, I said I wasn't going to go through all of it, but I guess I am.

[SPEAKER_00]: And in Wentworth are profoundly alike in their sense of sacrifice and duty, but also their capacity for selflessness and passion.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like those things make the draw them closer to each other.

[SPEAKER_00]: And then you have like obviously Edward and Eleanor, both people who are too buttoned up to really express themselves.

[SPEAKER_00]: Brandon and Marianne were Brandon is this guy who can't express himself unless he's and so drawn to the notion of someone who's free of society's oppressive norms.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like I can point to each love story in any of these books and talk about why it makes sense that these two people find each other and love each other.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I think Mansfield Park at this point is kind of a weird raid because it feels inexplicable why these people love each other.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, if we're trying to distill it down to something like one of the things you've just said it seems to be and I've said this before that he is not used to women not falling at his feet and so to have a woman who couldn't care less what he thinks of her is intriguing to him.

[SPEAKER_00]: very intriguing, but I think there is something to the William of it all.

[SPEAKER_00]: I really think that Henry Crawford sees something simpler than his own messed up fetids' cynical life in Fanny Price.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like it is like a little like the difference between I can fix him and she can fix me.

[SPEAKER_00]: He's thinking like who am I and what am I doing with my life and then there's this woman who just like

[SPEAKER_00]: lives outside of my, my gross and weird world.

[SPEAKER_02]: Does he want to be with her?

[SPEAKER_02]: Does he want to be here?

[SPEAKER_00]: Does he want to be with her?

[SPEAKER_00]: Does he want to be her brother?

[SPEAKER_02]: Like, there's a cousin.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I mean, if you were a cousin, you know how she'd feel.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, right.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then, and then he would get him a new one.

[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.

[SPEAKER_00]: No, but I think there is like a, there's something like striving in Henry Crawford.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like he's, when we meet him, he's bored and like amused and like trying to just find like little pockets of pleasure.

[SPEAKER_00]: Until he goes on to the next thing, he's like sick of it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, yeah, and Fanny, he sees Fanny in William and he's so much

[SPEAKER_00]: in being like, phanny or with phanny, and I think there's in the end season that.

[SPEAKER_02]: I also think, and maybe I'm reading too much into this.

[SPEAKER_02]: But like,

[SPEAKER_02]: He was raised by his uncle and aunt and he grew up thinking that that was fine, like he loves his uncle right, but we know from Mary that his uncle's a bad guy.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I think that he maybe has shut some part of himself.

[SPEAKER_02]: down to be able to cope with that life.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: And he's seeing now someone who also had a hard upbringing, like he's seen how she's treated and he's also seen that she's raised by her uncle, like she was left her family left her.

[SPEAKER_02]: Mm-hmm.

[SPEAKER_02]: to her uncle, but like she's had a lot of obstacles, and so has William, and he sees two people who turned out okay, and didn't become debautress and didn't become cut off from like their emotions necessarily.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like he sees the love between them and see that like it's possible to have that kind of genuinely affection.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I think that that intrigues him and he

[SPEAKER_02]: Kind of it's like oh yeah, can I have that too?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I will also add this one thing and this is going to be spoilers for night at the seven kingdoms So never even heard of that skip ahead if you're not interested.

[SPEAKER_00]: I will give you like the tiniest little like it's going to make sense when I say this basically night at the seven kingdoms is a game of thrones based TV show that follows a hedge night a K like a poor essentially freelance night Who doesn't have like a Lord that he's attached to so he doesn't have any lands.

[SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't have like many All-in got it kind of the guy

[SPEAKER_00]: And it's a bit of a lone wolf and cubs story because he takes on a squire who is this young kid named egg and you find his name's egg and that's adorable.

[SPEAKER_00]: Continue skipping ahead if he's still one night at the seven kingdoms spoilers.

[SPEAKER_00]: But you find out that he is descended from like the main royal line.

[SPEAKER_00]: He's a prince.

[SPEAKER_00]: But he's living as a pauper by choice.

[SPEAKER_00]: And there's like whole sequences where they do things like cooked together.

[SPEAKER_00]: He, like the hedgerine teaches them how to cook over fire and teaches him how to like brush the horses and teaches him how to like go and like play like tug of war.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like there's like the squires descended from the.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, okay got it.

[SPEAKER_00]: And he teaches him how to stitch and darn like a sock.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, and you see the like yearning this kid has.

[SPEAKER_00]: And it's juxtaposed against this fated, rotted life of luxury that he lives with his brothers and his father.

[SPEAKER_00]: And like you see that he's just when he's with them, he's like cusping on like the darkness that they all have inside them.

[SPEAKER_00]: But he wants to be with Hedge Knight because he wants to live that life where things are like he's learning to cook and he's learning to stitch and

[SPEAKER_00]: And it's a little patronizing when you come from luxury and you like really glorify the poor.

[SPEAKER_00]: But there's an element of it in Henry here.

[SPEAKER_00]: There's an element of like, I've been around all these like toxic London people and there's this woman who's just simple and like lovely and true and why can't I have that life?

[SPEAKER_00]: Why can't I be like that?

[SPEAKER_00]: Why do I have to live in this toxic fetid pool of corruption and and debauchery?

[SPEAKER_00]: Why can't I have a beautiful symbol life with a woman I could care about?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and Annie is the really really the fucking question.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it is the question.

[SPEAKER_02]: I was thinking about how it's also kind of like what you were just describing.

[SPEAKER_02]: Sounds similar to Jasmine running off with Aladdin.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: This is like a tried and true tale that prints us in the stable boy, like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah

[SPEAKER_00]: sexy lawyer lady in the big city going home and falling for the the lumberjack who teaches her the crew true meaning of Christmas falling for Christmas exactly you see that by the way I have not I know every home mark movie is like this Lindsay low hand fall is a rich and titled lady who spoilers for falling for christmas spoilers for falling for christmas she gets in a skiing accident and

[SPEAKER_02]: Get Sam Nija and is brought into this little inn and taking care of by none other than Court over street from Glee.

[SPEAKER_02]: Who?

[SPEAKER_02]: Court over street from Glee?

[SPEAKER_02]: Who?

[SPEAKER_02]: Court over street?

[SPEAKER_02]: He played Sam, not important.

[SPEAKER_02]: What's important here is that Henry sees a simpler life in Fanny.

[SPEAKER_02]: And while that is a little bit patronized, what's interesting?

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, sorry, I'm talking over myself.

[SPEAKER_02]: But he wants a simpler life, but doesn't know how to go about

[SPEAKER_00]: Does it know how to go about getting a geese-heat-the-type of person who can do that?

[SPEAKER_02]: Right, the question is, can he change?

[SPEAKER_00]: Can Henry Crawford change?

[SPEAKER_00]: Because right now, he's torn-dadoing his way through this woman's life.

[SPEAKER_00]: And it is not working for her, because we've been talking a lot for him, Henry's perspective.

[SPEAKER_00]: From fan-is perspective, this Lothario Nyan is creeping up on her and trying to use her brother's success.

[SPEAKER_00]: either like real or in or taunt her.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah and like meanwhile her cousin crush isn't even here to talk about it with her.

[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

[SPEAKER_02]: She also wonders how Mary who seems to have quote high and worldly notions of matrimony could possibly approve of this match.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think meaning that she believes that he would need to marry someone of his class.

[SPEAKER_00]: She wants the Crawfords to move up in the world.

[SPEAKER_00]: She's made this very clear and the fact that she'd be cool with her brother taking a hit financially.

[SPEAKER_00]: It doesn't really make sense.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to save this for the study questions, but like hold on to the question of like why Mary is so on board with this.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_00]: But go on.

[SPEAKER_02]: It says that Fanny is ashamed of her own doubts, and I had a question.

[SPEAKER_02]: I read it two ways.

[SPEAKER_02]: Is she ashamed that she doesn't think he's serious because she should feel more highly of herself, like is she ashamed that she doesn't think she's worthy?

[SPEAKER_02]: Or is she ashamed that she kind of hopes that he's serious?

[SPEAKER_02]: And I think that maybe she doesn't know which which her shame is coming from.

[SPEAKER_00]: I think that those two and also just the ashamed of her doubts in terms of like the propriety of just thinking this guy's making a mockery of her.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah, she has convinced herself that he is not serious by the time he insert home has come back into the room.

[SPEAKER_02]: But, she has a harder time, once he's in the room, because of the way he's looking at her.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, read this passage.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is really good.

[SPEAKER_02]: She had quite convinced herself of this before Sir Thomas and Mr. Crawford joined them.

[SPEAKER_02]: The difficulty was in maintaining the conviction quite so absolutely after Mr. Crawford was in the room.

[SPEAKER_02]: For once Sir twice, a look seemed forced on her, which she did not know how to class, among the common meaning.

[SPEAKER_02]: But she still tried to believe it no more than what he might have often expressed toward her cousins and 50 other women.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love that line.

[SPEAKER_00]: In any other man, it would be something earnest and something pointed, but she knows better.

[SPEAKER_00]: Because she watched him.

[SPEAKER_00]: She was on the ha.

[SPEAKER_00]: She was on the ha ha.

[SPEAKER_00]: She saw.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, this is like the thing that tains this whole book.

[SPEAKER_00]: If this book starts now, like essentially this book is a sense and sensibility with a prequel in some ways.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like when it comes like the willy beast, I've not exactly because I don't want to like say what Henry Crawford did tomorrow.

[SPEAKER_00]: I was

[SPEAKER_00]: Will it be like sexual deviance with a minor, but it's this notion of like she just has too much background to trust him.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, tough.

[SPEAKER_02]: He is trying to talk to her, but she's avoiding him.

[SPEAKER_02]: But at the end of the night, he finally makes his way up to her and asks if she is going to give Mary a response.

[SPEAKER_02]: And she's like, Oh, yes, I will do that.

[SPEAKER_02]: So she goes to write.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you so much.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you so much.

[SPEAKER_01]: I was so much for your good mind wishes.

[SPEAKER_01]: So happy for my brother.

[SPEAKER_01]: Also, never ever write me about the other thing ever again.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, she says she says we're not going to talk about that thing.

[SPEAKER_02]: What was the line?

[SPEAKER_02]: Um, she said this topic of conversation distresses me or this topic of conversation is unpleasant to me or uncomfortable for me.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Her letter to to Mary Crawford, I'll just read it.

[SPEAKER_02]: I am very much obliged to my dear Miss Crawford for your kind congratulations as far as they relate to my dearest William.

[SPEAKER_02]: The rest of your note, I know means nothing, but I am so unequal to anything of the sort that I hope you will excuse my begging you to take no further notice.

[SPEAKER_01]: The rest of my your note, I know means nothing.

[SPEAKER_02]: I know means nothing.

[SPEAKER_02]: I have seen too much of Mr. Crawford not to understand his manners.

[SPEAKER_02]: If he understood me as well, he would I dare say, behave differently.

[SPEAKER_02]: I do not know what I write, but it would be a great favor of you to never mention this subject again.

[SPEAKER_02]: With thanks and honor of your note, I remain damn as Crawford, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.

[SPEAKER_02]: Now, she,

[SPEAKER_02]: Normally, would reread Mary Crawford's note very carefully.

[SPEAKER_02]: She would think out everything she said.

[SPEAKER_02]: But under pressure, she just says the first thing that she thinks, which I am very proud of, our girl, Fanny Crawford, she heard while meds onto the page.

[SPEAKER_02]: However,

[SPEAKER_02]: It emphasizes multiple times that because she is rushed her handwriting gets worse and worse and her like rammer is bad and she's like not thinking it through so I just I fear that there might be a misreading of this letter some at some point.

[SPEAKER_02]: just imagine your Mary Crawford and you're like oh well there's again married to my friend it's gonna be great and then she gets this note bag and it looks like a random note it's like scribbled like you so much never speak of this to me again shut up stop talking he comes over and so she's like scribbling the end as he's walking over and he's like I didn't mean to rush you please take your time and she's like no no I'm done take this and then she runs away

[SPEAKER_02]: And I also worry that perhaps he might misread her body language here, which is like a shy Here's your lettery, but I don't think that's what she's doing at all, but I think he might see that.

[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know.

[SPEAKER_02]: I don't think he's like disappointed yet.

[SPEAKER_00]: Do automatic replies on email when you're out of office?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, so for me, like there's something I read the the words like, thank you for your email.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not at my desk like in a very specific voice over.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like,

[SPEAKER_00]: I picture someone like throwing a letter at you being like, no, she says, Mary Crawford, thank you for your email.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not a desk.

[SPEAKER_01]: I am out of office.

[SPEAKER_01]: Please excuse me to lay in response to my.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, never talk to me again.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I feel like that's also as she heads into Henry.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you for your email.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you for your proposal.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm out.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, literally.

[SPEAKER_02]: the last little bit of this chapter is just funny trying to focus on the joy of William's promotion yet again and hoping that the agitation of this proposal will go away now that she has cleared everything up through the letter she's like oh that took care of that yeah just pat myself on the back all day laptop shut till Monday yep and that's the end of that chapter uh remember when we thought we were going to do two chapters there was too much yeah

[SPEAKER_00]: All right, this brings us to the study questions.

[SPEAKER_00]: Listeners, if you would like to submit study questions, you can become a patron at the $15 tier on our Patreon.

[SPEAKER_00]: And then, while you're opposed to Google Doc, you submit those questions, we ask them.

[SPEAKER_00]: Hello, where's the notes?

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, you could leave that in.

[SPEAKER_00]: Leave it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, Avi asks, in these chapters, Mary Crawford displays an intimacy toward Fanny that Fanny does not reciprocate, do you believe these feelings from Mary are genuine?

[SPEAKER_02]: That is a good question.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, well, first of all, there's the question of whether Mary genuinely approves of the match, which I think we've talked about a little bit in the last episode, seems like a yes, but we don't know why.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, then her friendship towards Fanny, which in the letter she says, I am so glad I'm going to be able to call you Fanny instead of calling you Miss Price like I'm so glad that we're going to finally get to be sisters and that.

[SPEAKER_02]: feels like it might be genuine.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like we've talked before about how she doesn't have a lot of like fanny's her friend right now, her only friend.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: And so I do think that there is a genuineness in being like excited that her brother wants to marry her one friend.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know what?

[SPEAKER_00]: It's really hard to answer this yes and no, because it forces us to talk about the Crawford's as black and white characters.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I think one could build an argument on either side.

[SPEAKER_02]: Right, because on the one hand, she likes Fannie and she would love to have her be in her family on the other hand.

[SPEAKER_02]: That gets her closer to Edmund.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and I think those two motives are quite muddled together.

[SPEAKER_02]: And would she like Fannie if she wasn't Edmund's cousin?

[SPEAKER_00]: It's kind of irrelevant.

[SPEAKER_00]: She does like Fannie.

[SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know, like, I mean, it's not totally irrelevant.

[SPEAKER_00]: There's like Mary is an inherently selfish person and she keeps people around her when there's their views to her.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it doesn't mean there's not an infection there.

[SPEAKER_00]: She obviously has some heart because Edmund's not very useful to her.

[SPEAKER_00]: He's very inconvenient for her plans.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Um, so I don't know.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's like for me, like I could build a case that Mary Crawford is a misunderstood misguided woman who talks to sexually in a way that everyone else finds improper and is actively pursuing

[SPEAKER_00]: like her aunt did.

[SPEAKER_00]: On the other hand, I could build a case that she's wildly self-centered and has delusions of grandeur about what she can achieve through marriage and is toying with Edmund's heart and Fanny's time because she doesn't want to let go of him even though she doesn't know she's not the right match for her.

[SPEAKER_00]: I could

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, this book is hard because it asks us to care about characters in spite of many, many flaws.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it asks you to care about their Thomas despite the fact that he's literally the source of evil.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and Jane Austen is forcing us to confront these characters that are not nice.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, even Fannie herself is not a perfect character.

[SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'll be at a much closer to a perfect character than many of those that's around her.

[SPEAKER_00]: But she's forcing us to spend time with people who are not supposed to like that much, but who we can empathize with.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: So that's my answer on that one.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's a good answer.

[SPEAKER_02]: Good answer.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, thank you so much.

[SPEAKER_00]: Linnea asks, William has been promoted.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yay!

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, another sound effect.

[SPEAKER_00]: No one gets promoted in Jane Austen novels.

[SPEAKER_02]: This sound effect can be like, congratulations.

[SPEAKER_02]: You've been promoted.

[SPEAKER_00]: Or like a like a, like a ship's horror, like does ships have horns?

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Ah, blah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Give us a nice fall corn for William's promotion in the Navy.

[SPEAKER_03]: Congratulations.

[SPEAKER_03]: You won.

[SPEAKER_00]: Why do you think nobody has mentioned Henry's power to help before?

[SPEAKER_00]: Edmund didn't ask for it on Fanny's behalf.

[SPEAKER_00]: Mary didn't leverage her brother's sway with the admiral.

[SPEAKER_00]: So did Henry do it for unselfish love of Fanny or selfish pressure to make her accept him?

[SPEAKER_02]: All right, let's end to the first half first.

[SPEAKER_02]: Why has nobody else thought of this before?

[SPEAKER_02]: I think because nobody would have thought that Henry would have a reason to want to help Fanny.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's a huge ask.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's a huge ask and also like a random one since he has no connection to her.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, until now, until now.

[SPEAKER_02]: And as for whether he did it out of genuine love for Fanny or to manipulate her,

[SPEAKER_02]: Who's to say who I want to believe and this is going back to Jane Austen asking me to like a character despite the fact that maybe they're problematic I would like to believe that he did it.

[SPEAKER_02]: out of genuine love for Fanny and thought I'm going to do a nice thing for her and she's going to be so grateful and happy that'll be a great time to propose because she'll be in such a happy mood and why don't I just do all of the happy things at once.

[SPEAKER_02]: However, like I don't think that it's necessarily directly like he thought I'm going to do this nice thing for her and then proposed to her so she has to say yes.

[SPEAKER_02]: But I do think that is the result.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well,

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, not so much that she has to say yes, but I'm going to do this nice thing for her and therefore she will fall in love with me.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, to me, it seems like a part of the seduction.

[SPEAKER_00]: He's like studying Fanny to figure out what will make her happy and how he can get her to fall in love with him.

[SPEAKER_00]: And it doesn't mean that he doesn't want to do something nice to her.

[SPEAKER_00]: He is determined that Fanny is a genuine person.

[SPEAKER_00]: And also, again, I'm not to keep harping on this point, but like he does have this thing about William.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: He does like have this like genuine connection to like what William is in the world.

[SPEAKER_00]: And he understands that if he wants Fanny, he has to change.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: So it's kind of a mixed bag.

[SPEAKER_00]: There's this like good place.

[SPEAKER_00]: We're like if you do nice things For points with other people, then those things don't count.

[SPEAKER_00]: It'll make you a better person.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, exactly.

[SPEAKER_02]: Good.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I think that for him, like, he doesn't necessarily want to change in this moment.

[SPEAKER_02]: He thinks, I want to be more like William.

[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe I'll just help William be more William.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm so sorry.

[SPEAKER_00]: It just jumped to my brain.

[SPEAKER_00]: What if Henry is a little shell straw and Mary is to honey?

[SPEAKER_02]: And then Fanny is cheating.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's exactly what I was thinking.

[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like big tea is probably Jason.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Actually Edmund's really a cheery.

[SPEAKER_02]: Ah, but in this case, they're both cheating.

[SPEAKER_00]: Which two cheats is a tough situation to be in.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but just to really stick the point, I think that Henry may have done this for unselfish love of Fanny, thinking, not that it would force her to say yes to him, but that it would make her fall in love with him.

[SPEAKER_02]: Kind of like when Mary said in the last chapter,

[SPEAKER_02]: Fanny won't say yes to you without love, but she won't not fall in love with you.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like she she'll absolutely fall in love with you.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, show her that you love her and she'll fall in love back.

[SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.

[SPEAKER_02]: So that's what I think about that.

[SPEAKER_00]: So Emily asks, do you think the news of the proposal, Graham the sound effect, will reach nonslash sums slash all of the rest of the family would Fanny want any of them to know.

[SPEAKER_02]: Fanny wants to die with the secret.

[SPEAKER_02]: Fanny doesn't want anyone to find out about it.

[SPEAKER_00]: And he doesn't want Fanny to know about this.

[SPEAKER_02]: And he said, please take it back.

[SPEAKER_01]: I would like a lobotomy before I think about this again, please.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: So, no, if Annie does not want anyone to know she would much rather this be a bad dream.

[SPEAKER_02]: Do you think they'll reach the news will reach them, though?

[SPEAKER_02]: I think probably, I do think there is a possibility for Fanny's letter because there were so much empathy.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is just a prediction, but so much emphasis on how sloppily she wrote it, that there's a potential that this letter doesn't give as emphatic a nose she expected.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I do think that there's a possibility that Henry continues on thinking that he has a chance and tells people.

[SPEAKER_02]: But I also, he's cautious in some ways like he didn't tell anyone about Williams promotion until it was certain.

[SPEAKER_02]: So maybe he wouldn't tell anyone about his plans for Fanny until it's certain.

[SPEAKER_02]: But I don't trust that Mary won't tell anyone.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I think maybe Mary will tell Edmund or something.

[SPEAKER_00]: And just to build off this question, any predictions for reactions from the rest of the family, I mean, everyone's got to be thrilled, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: everyone.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, I suppose there's the question of Edmund.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, there is the question of Edmund, but think think broader in the family.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, the sisters.

[SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[SPEAKER_00]: Can't imagine Mrs. Rushworth being super thrilled with that news.

[SPEAKER_02]: No, actually, and there was a moment where Fanny was like,

[SPEAKER_02]: When she danced with him at the ball, she was like, I can't imagine my, like, she's like, I don't, I hope my cousins wouldn't grudge me this now.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like they wouldn't be jealous of me now taking their place.

[SPEAKER_02]: She didn't dance with him.

[SPEAKER_02]: It was that, but did he, she did, they started the ball.

[SPEAKER_00]: They did start the ball, but she was talking more broadly about having the ball, because Julia and Maria came out in society, not at a ball at their own home, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: But I think it was by moment that she was dancing with him that she thought of them.

[SPEAKER_00]: But Mary brings it up.

[SPEAKER_00]: To Henry when she can retails her that he's in love with Fanny.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, he's like, oh, that's gonna be a spicy thing when it comes to Mariah and And Julia and he's like, I don't care.

[SPEAKER_00]: You're so right.

[SPEAKER_00]: They're not as good and they treated Fanny like shit So I don't care.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh right, and he says I hope that they see how she should be treated and they feel bad for how they have treated her

[SPEAKER_02]: Uh oh, yeah, they're not in the middle.

[SPEAKER_02]: They're not in the middle.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but what can they do?

[SPEAKER_02]: They can't do anything.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, what is married?

[SPEAKER_00]: You're married.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Alright, that concludes our patron study questions moving on to our backestity questions.

[SPEAKER_00]: We have a proposal.

[SPEAKER_02]: Ta-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da.

[SPEAKER_00]: How does Austin write this proposal in comparison to how she has written other proposals?

[SPEAKER_02]: I think it's funny that we get this proposal entirely from Fanny's perspective and that she kind of blacks out during it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think this is like really removed.

[SPEAKER_00]: This is a bit of an out-of-body experience proposal.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like if you think about how we get whole, like, swaths of text, where these men are professing their love in different Jane Austen novels.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and this one's like, and suddenly he was offering her everything, and she was like fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck.

[SPEAKER_00]: And what you have here again is a sleep paralysis demon proposal.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, more I can't do some of like the bad proposals we've done.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's interesting.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, it's not exactly like a Mr. Elton or a Mr. Collins.

[SPEAKER_00]: No, it's actually he says very nice things.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but in those moments it's like he's doing his big profession of love and fan is like,

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: It is similar in response, like on Fanny's end to the Mr. Elton or the Mr. Collins.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Of like, sir, shut up.

[SPEAKER_00]: This is in Mr. Elton and Mr. Collins because we've got no Henry.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: And he's hot and he is like obviously a major love interest in the story.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: So let's talk about the proposal itself.

[SPEAKER_00]: Why does he propose at that moment?

[SPEAKER_00]: Do you think he planned to?

[SPEAKER_00]: I do, okay, I do actually, so the question I have as I have a phrase here is, is it presumptuous or impulsive?

[SPEAKER_00]: Because as I see it, it's either that he came in with the news about William and was like, this is the pathway to the grand achievement of raising both price siblings in society.

[SPEAKER_00]: any her marriage.

[SPEAKER_00]: And look at me doing all this good stuff for the price siblings.

[SPEAKER_00]: Again, quite condescending.

[SPEAKER_00]: Or we have seen that the power fanny holds over him is that when she is enamored, when she is adoring, when she is excited, when she is happy, it like makes him lose this fucking mind.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so then the question is whether or not it kind of came out of him.

[SPEAKER_00]: after delivering the news, and I don't think that's clear in the way it's written.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's not.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I think that like we kind of have to wait to see what he says about it after the fact, because I imagine that we'll get some sort of conversation about it.

[SPEAKER_02]: But I mean, he said to Mary in the last chapter when she said, what are you waiting for?

[SPEAKER_02]: He said only the opportunity.

[SPEAKER_00]: and was this the opportunity?

[SPEAKER_02]: I think he was waiting until he could tell her about William.

[SPEAKER_02]: And so he knew that when he told her about William, that would be when he told her that he was in love with her and wanted to marry her.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I think that I don't think it was impulsive.

[SPEAKER_02]: But like I said before, I don't think that it was necessarily intended to be manipulative.

[SPEAKER_02]: He just really thought that she was going to fall in love with him for that.

[SPEAKER_02]: And why not propose right after someone falls in love with you?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's just like a one to punch if you will.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, he was like as soon as she has a positive feeling towards me.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's when I strike.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's the bads my moment.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so I don't want to think that I wouldn't think of it as like, I mean, it's definitely presumptuous.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I think he definitely thought of it in advance.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's what I think.

[SPEAKER_02]: Naughty, naughty boy.

[SPEAKER_02]: But I think it would be fun if it was impulsive.

[SPEAKER_02]: I just don't, he literally already said that he was just waiting for the opportunity.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: So.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_00]: What does it mean for Fanny that William is promoted?

[SPEAKER_00]: How does that change the story?

[SPEAKER_02]: You know, and it's a good question because it doesn't really change her status at all, like I read it as like she's just so happy for her brother, but I guess there's a little bit less power held over him by the Bertram family, it's also money like yeah he's independent now.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, he could make money and like so there's her way out of this is marriage.

[SPEAKER_00]: His way out of this is raising his rank in the Navy to a point where he actually has a good solid fortune and lieutenant is the first to step on that path.

[SPEAKER_02]: And if he had enough of a good solid fortune, she could get out before marriage, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: Like if, for example,

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it'd be difficult because he is overseas all the time, but theoretically like if you're say like you look at this in terms of like Captain one worth in his siblings like Captain one worth ultimately has the money to lease a massive house and theoretically his sister who had enough money to do it on her own kind of gone and live with him if she were on married she would have just been alone in the household the time.

[SPEAKER_00]: So like theoretically, that could happen.

[SPEAKER_00]: If any chose not to marry, she could go and live in some household and purchased ultimately, but it's going to be a long time before he's worth that kind of money.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's more at this point like she has a connection to someone who's like tolerable in society.

[SPEAKER_00]: The rest of the price family has more food on the table.

[SPEAKER_00]: He is making his step up in society and ultimately it puts a little pressure on Fanny to make her move.

[SPEAKER_00]: That's my thing.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think I understand.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mostly understand the part where he's higher up in society now so her connections have improved.

[SPEAKER_00]: They have.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: The pressure thing like it's like it's her turn now.

[SPEAKER_02]: Is that what you're saying?

[SPEAKER_00]: Well again, the prices are making their way up in the world and Fanny has won vehicle for that.

[SPEAKER_00]: William had a different vehicle.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: I get it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Finally, we have finished volume the second, which I totally knew we were doing.

[SPEAKER_00]: And let's talk through the volume.

[SPEAKER_00]: Do you remember where volume the first ended?

[SPEAKER_02]: The ball?

[SPEAKER_02]: No.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just going to tell you because you're going to have like a moment of like how long is this fucking book when did volume the first end during the play?

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh my god, I forgot about the play.

[SPEAKER_02]: How could I forget about Lover's Val?

[SPEAKER_00]: Our guy Yates are king.

[SPEAKER_02]: Remember when I thought he was coming back?

[SPEAKER_00]: All right, please.

[SPEAKER_00]: Man.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so in the time, since volume the first ended,

[SPEAKER_00]: The other three Bertrams, now the fourth Bertram, have all left Mansfield Park leaving Fanny alone with Sir Thomas, who is back, Lady Bertram, and Mrs. Norris.

[SPEAKER_00]: You have Mary and Henry taking center stage in the story in a much larger way than they even did in the first volume.

[SPEAKER_00]: The first volume is very much about Fanny's feelings and everybody.

[SPEAKER_00]: And about the flirtations between Henry and Mariah, the flirtation between Edmund and Mary, Fanny's unrequited cousin crash.

[SPEAKER_00]: And just a lot of stuff that's like building and doesn't really like go anywhere.

[SPEAKER_00]: This second section has been about Fanny coming forward, you know?

[SPEAKER_00]: What else is it?

[SPEAKER_00]: What else?

[SPEAKER_00]: Tell me more.

[SPEAKER_02]: the Renaissance of Fanny Price, or the first birth, I suppose, not first birth, any price.

[SPEAKER_02]: She's gotten hot.

[SPEAKER_02]: She has gotten more attention.

[SPEAKER_02]: She's come out.

[SPEAKER_02]: She is in the marriage pool now.

[SPEAKER_02]: Sir Thomas has started appreciating her.

[SPEAKER_02]: more and like treating her more as a part of the family as it's posed to like the attic wench the attic the Cinderella yeah she's like a part of the family now despite Mrs. Norris's best efforts and honestly Mrs. Norris has been in the story a lot less which is kind of nice like I feel like she was not as big of a part as a volume to not at all because

[SPEAKER_02]: She weighs less on Fanny's head, I feel like, because she's not talking shit to Fanny to her face anymore.

[SPEAKER_00]: And Fanny, you're a man falling in love with her.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, Fanny got a man to fall in love with her without even trying.

[SPEAKER_00]: Ah, the dream, honestly.

[SPEAKER_02]: And like, a rich man.

[SPEAKER_02]: But she doesn't believe that he's falling in love with her yet.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like, she's still teetering on the the brink of that.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: She thinks that she's the butt of some joke right now.

[SPEAKER_02]: And let's remember where Henry was.

[SPEAKER_02]: Henry has had to growth.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like, listeners, I know this man is flawed, but we must appreciate that he is doing the best that he knows how.

[SPEAKER_02]: Because he started from a place where he never wanted to get married and he only wanted to flirt and he wanted to make as many women fall in love with him as possible, but he didn't care about their feelings or their reputations.

[SPEAKER_02]: Suddenly,

[SPEAKER_02]: he cares a lot about someone's feelings and reputation.

[SPEAKER_02]: He cares a lot about how fan he is treated and he wants people to atone for their sins of treating her badly.

[SPEAKER_02]: In fact, and he wants to do every nice thing that he can for her simply so that she will smile at him.

[SPEAKER_02]: And so that's a huge jump.

[SPEAKER_02]: The fact that he doesn't know how to portray that in a way that

[SPEAKER_02]: Like, maybe he'll get there, in volume three.

[SPEAKER_02]: Funny is to quote, oh, man, there are so many good options.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think it's got to be this.

[SPEAKER_02]: So Henry has just proposed or expressed his love.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to read a larger chunk.

[SPEAKER_02]: While her heart was still bounding with joy and gratitude on volumes behalf, she could not be severely resentful of anything that injured only herself.

[SPEAKER_02]: And after having twice drawn back her hand and twice attempted in vain to turn away from him, she got up and said only with much agitation, don't Mr. Crawford, pretty don't.

[SPEAKER_02]: I beg you would not.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is a sort of talking which is very unpleasant to me, but I must go away.

[SPEAKER_02]: I cannot bear it.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is the sort of talking that is very unpleasant to me, and it's him like bearing his soul and saying he loves her very much.

[SPEAKER_00]: This is very unpleasant.

[SPEAKER_00]: This is the sort of talking that is very unpleasant to me.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to use that from now on.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I'm really going to get shirts and say that.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_00]: I want that on a t-shirt.

[SPEAKER_00]: I want that on a mug.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I just want to flash it.

[SPEAKER_00]: What is time?

[SPEAKER_02]: It's perfect.

[SPEAKER_02]: All right.

[SPEAKER_02]: Questions moving forward when will Henry try again because he's simply must he can't take no for an answer to this guy Will it be the sort of thing where he's like if your feelings are still what they were last April blah, blah, blah Mr. Darcy style like let it breathe let her be and then come back when he's changed or will he just continue trying like is he gonna change?

[SPEAKER_02]: is Henry Crawford going to change the question we didn't talk at all about Mary and Edward and Mary and Edmund in this chapter so like I did I did I just forgot Edmund oh my god god bless the cousin crush but like is he gonna come back also

[SPEAKER_02]: to give credit where credit is due, Fannie did not once think of him in this chapter.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, she's a little preoccupied.

[SPEAKER_02]: But like you would think, like you get proposed to and you're like, but what about my love?

[SPEAKER_02]: That's great question.

[SPEAKER_02]: So just saying, yeah, I'm curious if he's coming back and if so when who wins the chapters, or chapter I should say.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to give it to Fanny.

[SPEAKER_02]: OK, what were you thinking?

[SPEAKER_02]: I was thinking will you?

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, sure.

[SPEAKER_02]: He got a promotion.

[SPEAKER_02]: He got a promotion.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, he wins in terms of what he gained in this chapter.

[SPEAKER_02]: Fanny wins for her steadfast denial of this man.

[SPEAKER_02]: And also just for iconic turn of phrase.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, truly iconic.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: All right listeners, this concludes this episode of Pot and Prejudice for next time.

[SPEAKER_00]: We're only going to read one chapter.

[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to do chapter 32, aka chapter 1 of Volume III.

[SPEAKER_00]: Molly, we're in the last volume.

[SPEAKER_00]: The final volume.

[SPEAKER_00]: Who would have thought, I mean, our listeners eventually.

[SPEAKER_00]: We've been reading this book for six months.

[SPEAKER_02]: I thought this book was going to keep going.

[SPEAKER_02]: I was like, how many volumes are there?

[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe five.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I mean, three is three is manageable.

[SPEAKER_02]: All right.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, until next time, stay proper.

[SPEAKER_02]: And don't abide, talking that is very unpleasant to you.

[SPEAKER_03]: No, do it.

[SPEAKER_02]: Potent Pajadis is edited by Molly Birdick and audio produced by Graham Cook.

[SPEAKER_02]: Our show art is designed by Torrance Brown.

[SPEAKER_02]: Our show is transcribed by speech docs, podcast transcription.

[SPEAKER_02]: For transcripts, and to learn more about our team, check out our website at potentpajadis.com.

[SPEAKER_02]: To keep up with the show, you can follow us on social media at Potent Pajadis.

[SPEAKER_02]: If you love what you hear, check out our Patreon to see how you can support us by some merch at pod and prejudice.dashery.com or just drop us a rating and a review wherever you get your podcasts.

[SPEAKER_02]: Stay proper.